Hi, sort of a long shot here but maybe someone will see this and it can be passed on to Josh directly, or to Stef and Mike so it can be brought up to others like Josh if they call in in the future.
Josh described feeling very anxious, and was essentially unable to converse even though he had waited through several call in shows to do so.
Mike tried to help him get started by relating his experience with anxiety, Mike said his original approach to this was to try to wargame or plot out conversations in advance prior to talking, so that he would not accidentally say the wrong thing. And of course, this is impossible.
Years ago before I found this show, when I had almost no self awareness or self knowledge, I too suffered acute anxiety in public, like Mike said, even in checkout lines and such. Sometimes my reaction was so severe that I don't think I would have felt much differently if someone had been pointing a gun at me; difficulty breathing, high heart rate... I was spooled up to run away 110%. It was mostly triggered by women I found attractive or who found me attractive, or men who were big enough to win against me in a fight. When Mike related his experience I had to completely put down my tools and just listen... ( I was at work ) It was like he was telling my story.
What I wanted to share is my synthesis of things I've learned about this... maybe it can help someone else too. If you have anxiety like that, check this out:
#1 No one knows you better than yourself.
#2 You believe you have flaws that make you unacceptable in conversation. While most people have room for improvement in conversation and you probably do too, you may be hearing an internalized critic that is unrealistic or abusively harsh.
#3 Here is where things go awry - You believe you are a flawed and unacceptable person, and this can't be changed. And, if people really find out who you are, you will be rejected.
#4 You decide to mitigate that with being fully conscious in conversation, using learned skills, such as "pick up artists" promote, reading books about conversational tactics, and planning beforehand.
#5 You fail.
The reason is, as Malcolm Gladwell's book "Blink" points out, most mental processing is unconscious. To be 100% engaged in a conversation means to be using that narrow focus of conscious awareness, PLUS the broad awareness that occurs below decks, where you don't immediately even know its happening. You respond sometimes WITHOUT thinking... what some people might call "blurting" out responses. If you have learned to be 100% in the moment, in the way that Alan Watts or Ekhart Tolle might describe, what you say will sometimes even be a surprise to you! Almost like you are hearing someone else speak! You do not have to think of what to say next. It's almost like it is provided to you. You react without thinking, as a martial artist or expert dancer would do.
When you try to fully consciously vet everything you say, you are missing all that below decks information and instinct, and so you are severely handicapped. That's no fun. You cannot waste time listening to what is being said to you... you have to think of what YOU are going to say next. This is stressful and impossible, for more than a few moments. Almost everyone will realize you are doing this after just a few verbal exchanges and be put off by it.
So, why would you do that? Because you have unprocessed issues, and your unconscious is instinctively and sometimes brutally honest, and if you don't keep that monster in check with a conscious act , it will reveal to your fellow conversationalist who you really are. Like in Pink Floyd's The Wall, you will be "exposed before your peers". Oh no! And you believe these issues you have cannot be changed, that they are inherent and fundamental to you.
This, my friend, would make anyone nervous.
So I believe you will find, as I did, that spending a great deal of time conversing with yourself, and probably with a therapist too is the best place to start. Conversing in an environment where your unconscious self can safely participate without judgement. Give it a venue so you can hear what is in there. The truth is, you can improve and change fundamentally if you want to. Once you know yourself, and trust yourself, and love yourself, and are integrated, you can trust your unconscious self to join you in conversation with other people... nothing to hide, fully authentic. Then you will bring 100% of yourself to conversation and enjoy it.
FWIW My experience now is that when I meet someone new and converse, shortly afterwards I realize I could have said something better, or I missed something, or some other reaction would have been more friendly. I'm still putting the proverbial foot in my mouth on a regular basis. But each time there is a lesson and an improvement that gets added to my set of reactions, and that is delightful to experience. The same forgiveness I extend to others for less than perfect conversation I extend to myself.
Good luck Josh!
