HELP! - The Evils of Child Labor Laws: How Do Today's Young Workers Possibly Find Jobs?

[Melissa McWilliams]

*Update...check below

 

Our government has committed literally countless unforgivable crimes against us and continues to do so every moment of every day, from outright theft of our hard-earned property to open slaughter of innocent civillians, domestic and overseas. One of such crimes is intentionally, fiercely barring ambitious young people like me from entering the workforce.

 

First, a bit of background on myself: I am very thankful and lucky to have been born and raised by a functional, peaceful family. I was privately educated at VanDamme Academy (one of the best, most expensive schools in California, run by objectivists) until I had to drop out of 7th grade due to administrative problems with the school. My mother half-homeschooled, half-unschooled me, allowing me to choose my areas of interest, until 10th grade when my enthusiasm in academics quickly began to wane as my attention turned to starting work and making money. I graduated high school at age fifteen in order to start working, in hopes of attaining personal and financial freedom earlier in my life.

 

Since mid-2012, I've run my own freelance graphics design business online, serving clients daily all over the world. I began entering international logo design contests to get more business. I became a volunteer instructor for a rifle marksmanship and American history program, RWVA Project Appleseed, in November of 2012. Over this past year, I have gained enough experience to attain confidence in myself as a potential entry-level employee and put together a pretty good-looking resume. However, in an interview I had at a retail store last week, my whole view on entering the workforce took a turn for the worse.

 

A Voluntaryist by heart and mind, I have come to recognize ANY business or trade regulation as a gross violation of our natural property rights. The government has NO right to decide who may and may not make an honest living, how much or how little we may make, what we do with the fruits of our labor, etc. Child labor laws are one of these regulations. I knew they were bad... but little did I know that they are half as bad as they truly are.

 

The hiring manager who was interviewing me didn't realize that I am still legally considered a "minor" until about halfway through the questionnaire. It was then she mentioned that the state of California has a law that prohibits people under eighteen years of age from working any more than 8 hours a day on the weekends, and 3 hours a day on the weekdays. Not just given by one employer, but any and all employers I may have.

 

This is obscene.

 

Here I am, out of school and looking for work. I want to get off my parents' backs; they've supported me long enough. And yet-- assuming I'm making the minimum wage that businesses are forced at gunpoint to pay me, even if I don't deserve it, and I work every last hour that I'm allowed to-- I'm tied down to only being able to earn less than $250 a week for the next two years.

 

Add in the fact that, as a minor, I am now a legal liability to the company. I probably wouldn't be much use to a company at this point, because businesses are forbidden from letting me operate any machinery labeled "dangerous" (that includes dishwashers, stoves, grinders, heat presses... stuff that makes the world go 'round).

 

With this weight around my neck, how can I possibly make enough to purchase a car and pay for gas and insurance myself, and eventually move out of California and live on my own within these next few years, keeping up with my rent, utilities, insurance, food, healthcare, you name it-- even if it's a bare subsistence lifestyle which I'm willing to live? In other words... how can I bypass the laws, so to speak, in order to make more than the state allows me to?

 

Thank you for your time, and for putting up with one long-arse rant.

 

In the name of life and liberty,

Melissa McWilliams

 

PS: If you're a business in the Lincoln/Rocklin/Roseville area of CA, I'll send you my resume for your records.

[Kevin Beal]

Hi Melissa

 

I checked out your t-shirts and they are totally awesome. And congratulations on the contest wins!

 

I know what you mean about the child labor laws. It's totally absurd. Ironically, it's legal to work from age 13 in Arizona (where I'm from) if you work for the government, and I don't know if they had the same number of hours restriction, I don't think so. (My first job was working for local government). It's insanely hypocritical, but there you have it.

 

I don't have any advice really, but I think that if an employer can get past the "minor" thing, then you are in an awesome position to get an entry level position since you are so self directed and ambitious. And the right kind of employer, I think, will try and figure something out even if there is that (government introduced) liability.

 

I think it's a great idea posting this on the FDR forums too since it seems ideal to work with/for other liberty folk.

 

Good luck!

[Melissa McWilliams]

Thanks, Kevin!

 

Really? Does the 13+ law in AZ only apply to government institutions, or does it also apply to private businesses? If indeed they're still forcing 13-15 year-olds out of independent jobs, then the irony is glaringly ridiculous... but it's good enough for government work, I suppose.

 

Thanks again, and I hope you're right. I'm just trying to keep that work ethic going, to keep applying and re-applying for jobs, and to keep finding ways to make money outside of employers.

Absolutely.

 

Melissa

[PatrickC]

Hi Melissa,

 

I totally understand what you mean about these child labour laws. What is particularly frustrating is that they make it sound as if they're doing you a favour too. The reality is that they fear the young, because they can out price them. This is the real reason for restricting hours, days of the week and the minimum wage. So I sympathise enormously.

 

I had three jobs when I was 16. Little did I know it, but when I left school (1985) Margaret Thatcher had just abolished the Wage Council which used to set minimum wages for the UK. This enabled most of my friends of the same age to get jobs too. Fast forward to today and I barely see a young person under 20 in a job. I put this down in part to a failing and over regulated economy, but also the re-introduction of the minimum wage in 1999.

 

I think you're doing the right thing with your online T-shirt business. Learning how to exploit and profit from this extraordinary medium called the internet will be very beneficial for you in the long run. Actually online businesses are indeed an opportunity for the young looking for work experience. A number of online services are based abroad (such as Asia) and they aren't compelled by the nonsense laws of the West. Sometimes these are even US/European targeted companies that just happen to be based in Bangkok or Manila, because of the cheaper business costs. I am sure if you were able to ask these companies if they had a role which you could do at minimum cost to them that many would be interested. You could even be explicit about your reasons and that you are really interested in gaining some work experience, which you cannot find in the US due to the current regulations.

 

Another thing that I recommend to many young people in the UK, is when you get that passport go to Asia. You'll find no end of them on this board as well. Jobs are plentiful in this region and they are not just teaching jobs either. Sales, design, administration jobs abound too. It's quickly becoming the only way for young people (with a brain) to actually get work experience. Of course traveling is a great experience all round, but mixed up with working can be a significant lift off for your future life.

 

Failing that, since you said you have a very supportive family why not try and find some volunteer work. I know this means you remain a cost to your parents. But even a year of working volunteering can up your value to future employers considerably. I think your parents would understand this and you might feel that remaining under their care for a short while longer to be a useful stepping stone in this statist world. Anyway, whatever you do, best wishes all the same.

[PhilipJ]

Hi Melissa,

It certainly sucks when the state stands in the way of two parties mutually benefiting.

Your graphics work is nice - have you considered freelancing options like eLance? With your skills you may be able to bypass employers altogether and support yourself fully via design work if that is something you're interested in.

[Kevin Beal]

Really? Does the 13+ law in AZ only apply to government institutions, or does it also apply to private businesses? If indeed they're still forcing 13-15 year-olds out of independent jobs, then the irony is glaringly ridiculous... but it's good enough for government work, I suppose.

 

If memory serves me, it is only for government jobs or if your parents own the business. It is totally ridiculous. But at least I got to start working at an earlier age. That helped me a lot to get jobs later.

 

Another idea that I had having watched the careers of many Googlers, is that it can be good to find a company you like a lot and do work for them for free or do work that benefits people in general. For example some of the better known Googlers come from the open source community and put in lots of time working on projects they never got paid for (except thru donations). Kevin Rose (another Googler) has a show he does where he interviews successful entrepreneurs in the tech field (which is great just btw) and someone redesigned his website for him for free and he got mentioned on the show, and I'm sure he got work out of that since he did such an awesome job, and worked for people with similar values too I'm sure.

 

It sounds like you are very proactive like that already having your own online store and taking part in competitions. It's just crazy that someone like you would be pushed out of the workforce. We live in some very strange times.

[Melissa McWilliams]

@xelent

 

I agree. The powers-at-be claim to be doing me a service, by intentionally holding me back, by claiming that they're keeping me free from the stress and the hard work of the free market, by attempting to subvert me in every last way they can. It's blatantly obvious that they know fully well how destructive and oppressive their policies are, and that their claims are just a sugarcoat over the poisonous truth of their real intentions.

 

Wow... congratulations! This is one of so many reasons why I wish I was born a few years earlier, but there's no use lamenting what can't be changed. C'est la vie. It's rare that I ever see a 16-18 year old actually working, and if I do, they're usually stuck with a few minimum wage hours a week in a fast food kitchen (a job which, at this point, I would flat-out pounce on if it were offered to me).

 

Thanks! I've found that the internet is an incredibly useful "under-the-table" tool for doing commerce freely, and that graphics design is quite possibly one of the least regulated industries in existence. I suppose that's one upside to having been born when I was: if not, then I wouldn't be able to connect with the clients I have (most of whom are outside of the US). Really? That's great to hear! I'd love to contact a few of these companies and see if I can be of any service to them. If you don't mind, do you know of any in particular?

 

That sounds wonderful and I'll be looking into that. Unfortunately, at this point my family is nowhere near in a position to support such a decision, and personally the thought of international travel is strangely terrifying to me. But for a long-term plan (or perhaps a SHTF bug-out plan for myself and my family), you might be onto something.

 

I have! I've been with an organization called the Revolutionary War Veterans Association (RWVA) since November of 2012, helping to teach people the skill sets of rifle marksmanship and spreading the word of American history. I've put it on my resume and it certainly is challenging work, though immensely rewarding. You can read about it here: http:appleseedinfo.org. Thank you very much for your detailed reply and your advice, and I wish you all the best as well!

 

 

@PhilipJ

 

That looks great! I'll look into it... thanks!

 

 

@Kevin

 

Oooooooooooof course it is! Don't be foolish, Comrade Citizen, your children are safest when they're held bound to the loaded guns of the state. I agree; my main goal is to achieve financial independence and ultimately happiness, which I'll reach sooner the earlier I can begin working.

 

That's a great idea! I actually plan to send logos to companies "in need," and I've offered my services to companies such as Calguns and Liberty Maniacs. Maybe the Freedomain Radio store needs a super cheap or volunteer designer? That show looks interesting; thanks for the link.

 

I agree. When I step back and look at the "big picture," it never ceases to amaze me that people should have this inherent desire to dominate and ultimately destroy others.

[Kevin Beal]

Haha, yes, definitely.

 

I have myself an FDR (freedomain radio) shirt right now that got attacked by some moths apparently. Probably statist moths at that

 

I'll be getting myself a new one at some point.

 

Also, here's a cool Kickstarter that might interest you: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/595168866/wear-your-heart-on-your-sleeve-t-shirts-for-philos

[PatrickC]

Sounds like your doing a lot of awesome stuff already. Keep that up and your value will be sky high in no time.

 

Here's a podcast that might interest you by a friend and a fellow board member where he interviews entrepreneurs and discusses ways to approach entrepreneurship. I'm sure he would be delighted to hear from your experiences with your online shopping businesses. Jake is his name.

 

http://www.thevoluntarylife.com/

[actions]

I would say as a fellow freelancer serial entrepreneur- keep your head up and take advantage of your graphic design skills by marketing higher premium monthly retainers to clients, that way you don't need a job with a "company". I was on the daily grind to always fine new jobs to do, and it got really old fast, because the money isn't always the same as you may know. You have good weeks with everyday booked to the next week not as great. So I what I did was I went to all the clients I did work before and I said "I'm offering a new service as my skills are in demand a lot lately and I want to keep my best clients on board such as you, so you're guaranteed to have my services when you need. For $500 a month you can have 20 hours a month of my time, that breaks down to $25 an hour, and for my skills that's cheap labor"....

 

I was really skeptical about the results that I would get but it changed my life, because now I have 4 monthly clients that pay me every month $500. If you find the majority of your clients are one time opportunist, then i would suggest calling agencies and saying "I have a monthly service...bla bla...here is my portfolio...you can have this many hours per month at X price and with that time purchased you can get X done"....

 

It's easy to get caught up in the I need a job for a company, but if you're really good and won that many competitions like you say you have, I would harness that and use that as you USP (unique selling proposition), in your pitch when selling your services to agencies or clients, because you're clients might think ohhh she did a great job for me, but when you add hey by the way I'm this good because I won 14 awards, you will only move up in there eyes in my opinion.

[Melissa McWilliams]

@Kevin

 

That looks like a very cool site. Thanks; I'll look into that!

 

 

@xelent

 

I appreciate your kind and inspirational words.

 

Awesome; I'll look into that too. Thanks!

 

 

@actions

 

Goddamn, that is BRILLIANT! Thank you so much for sharing your strategy!!

 

Absolutely. All I can say is that I agree 100%, and I definitely think you're more than onto something there.

 

It seems to me, though, that at market price I should also be able to offer web design in addition; I'm pretty good with using the GoDaddy platform and have put together a couple small sites with it, but I know next to nothing about from-scratch HTML coding (I'll be taking web design next college semester). I can make cool little GIF links like the ones in my signature (wheee!), but that's about it. I'm curious to know if people will generally pay for a "graphic and web designer" who doesn't use HTML, but instead uses a "point-and-click" builder (assuming that's a secondary service to graphics design, and not in the forefront of what I offer)?

 

Thank you all for your time and your very helpful responses!

[Kevin Beal]

I'm curious to know if people will generally pay for a "graphic and web designer" who doesn't use HTML, but instead uses a "point-and-click" builder (assuming that's a secondary service to graphics design, and not in the forefront of what I offer)?

 

That depends. I actually work as a web designer/developer and have worked at two different companies doing that.

 

If the kinds of projects you get are business card/brochure type websites with maybe a few pages and no Javascript necessary then you can totally do that with a WYSIWYG editor (technical name for a "point-and-click" builder). I vaguely remember the goDaddy WYSIWYG editor being especially limited in what it can do though, as compared to something like Dreamweaver.

 

Technically the editor creates HTML for you, so it's always going to be HTML based.

 

Another option would be to use WordPress (or other similar service) and use any of the thousands of free templates out there. If you do that, you can use what they call "plugins" to do more complex things on a website (contact forms, slideshows etc). There are also a lot of little ways that you can modify things that only require a limited understanding of HTML/CSS. Things like adding your own graphics into the existing template.

 

I started out on WYSIWYG editors, then moved to Wordpress and now I do everything in a code editor. I got a couple of odd jobs when I was WYSIWYG-ing it up, but I was in high school and wasn't really pursuing it. My first web job as an employee was working on Wordpress sites and that is a popular way that web designers in my area make a living. People even do eCommerce with it.

 

So to answer your question, yes, but your options are going to be limited if you are just starting out.

 

It's been my observation that many graphic designers are learning how to code. I dabble in graphic design, but am not as skilled as you or Phil by any means. I think that the two things actually compliment each other pretty well. General design principles have made me a better coder and vice versa. So if you are interested in web design, then I would definitely encourage you to look into it. A college course on it is an excellent start.

 

P.S. If you haven't checked out Dribbble.com yet, it's both super awesome and a way that graphic designers sometimes find work.

[STer]

Anyone interested in this topic might really be interested in the chapters called School Daze I and School Daze II in Daniel Quinn's book My Ishmael. Reading those chapters years ago was when I finally got an understanding of why we treat adolescents in our culture the way we do in terms of school and jobs.

[Melissa McWilliams]

Sorry for the delay, Kevin; I'd been at a long distance Appleseed shoot all weekend up in Hat Creek and am getting back into my usual workflow.

 

That is awesome, and thank you for sharing your knowledge and your experience! It seems to me that using WYSIWYG editors would not only serve as a temporary crutch while I learn HTML, but will also serve to teach me a thing or two about it, if there's an option to be able to see the underlying coding and watch what happens while I work with the site. I'll definitely be entwining my graphic and (soon-to-be) web design skills, in hopes of being able to work for a graphics design firm someday (and simply providing a profitable and high quality service for now).

 

Dribbble looks good too... thanks again for all your help!!

[Ovi]

Hello Melissa,

 

First, let me say I understand your situation since I've been there myself some time ago. I've since managed to establish myself first a a freelancer and then found a stable working relationship with one of my freelance customers. After a lot of work and improvement, that relationship developed into a partnership about a year ago, and i moved from being a freelancer into being an entrepreneur. It's going great!

 

So keep strong and keep honing your skills. That's what matters the most, not your age (or anything else).

 

You should look into 99Designs it's a site for graphic designers built on a form of open competitive market - crowd-sourcing. People who need designs for whatever purpose (from logo design to print design to web design and business cards) come there and post projects along with an amount of money they are offering. Then, interested designers submit their proposals, and the best one gets picked and gets paid. 

 

The money you make there is directly related to how good your skills are, that's why i think it would be a good fit for you since you seem to have a lot of talent and skill. You would compete really well there, in my opinion. Also, you may have a greater chance to work on projects you are interested on and passionate about.

 

We are constantly looking for talented and skilled web designers but it seems you are more focused on print at the moment.

 

A word of caution: don't make the mistake of just taking your print skills, however awesome, and assuming they just transfer to web design as is. I've seen a lot of awesome print designers fall on their face due to this. Web is a different medium, and while a lot of design principles are common with print, a lot of them are totally new or different.

 

I wish you all the best,

Ovi

[Melissa McWilliams]

@Ovi

 

Thank you very much for your thoughtful reply... and again, I'm sorry for the delay in getting back. Been quite busy lately, but that's no excuse to give the cold shoulder to someone who's put time and effort into providing an answer.

 

I'm very glad to hear that! That is fantastic, and in my situation I seem to have circumstances that would allow the same thing. (I have a satisfied client who is also an artist, and also a good friend who is incredibly good at concept sketching, which I myself could be better at.)

 

Thank you very much, and I will. That is a premise I operate on-- that chronology has little to nothing to do with being able to design and do commerce.

 

Thanks! I've heard of 99 Designs; I'm part of a similar website called LogoMyWay. I might switch over to 99 Designs if they have a "blind phase" during the contests, in which designers can't see each others' work (since I have a big problem with people always copying my work). I've been on LogoMyWay for quite some time, and while it is a good source of extra cash, it is by no means reliable and not always enjoyable; I'm looking to move on.

 

Wow... thank you so much. As of right now, my biggest problem is hugely undervaluing my work, since all I can see in it is one flaw or another. I'm working on getting the idea in my head that my work is worth it-- if it wasn't, then I wouldn't have the number of clients that I do. Your words are very kind and inspirational and much appreciated.

 

That is very sound advice. I just finished building my graphics design site, WingspanGraphics.com; I'm offering website design as just something extra, since I not only enjoy print more, but also am much better at it. I can build a simple website with Wordpress (as I did for Wingspan) that looks fairly good and works, but not much else. I'm also trying to focus my work and market to a specific need, rather than spread myself too thin.

 

And I wish the same to you!

Melissa

[Reason]

Another thing that I recommend to many young people in the UK, is when you get that passport go to Asia. You'll find no end of them on this board as well. Jobs are plentiful in this region and they are not just teaching jobs either. Sales, design, administration jobs abound too. It's quickly becoming the only way for young people (with a brain) to actually get work experience. Of course traveling is a great experience all round, but mixed up with working can be a significant lift off for your future life.

 

Interesting. Could you be a little bit more specific about where to look in Asia? I'd like to do this although the only option I was aware of was English teaching.

[PatrickC]

Interesting. Could you be a little bit more specific about where to look in Asia? I'd like to do this although the only option I was aware of was English teaching.

 

Well, I will be talking with my brother this coming weekend who runs a sales team in Thailand. He's in contact with a few companies and employers in that region, so he might be able to give me some details for you.

 

Failing that, you can do online research yourself. I recommend Thailand, Japan, Korea, Honk Kong, Singapore and China primarily as the countries to look at.

 

Teaching jobs are fairly easy to come by and often a good start for those that want to acclimatise to a different culture, before attempting some more entrpreneurial pursuits.

 

A fellow on the board, Pheonix Zerin has a blog about his current experiences working and living abroad. He also does a podcast too.

 

http://www.fiveyearsabroad.com/

[Melissa McWilliams]

Update: You guys rock!! Thank you so much for your help and your encouraging words. Since I made this posting, I've gotten (and almost outgrown) my first "real" job; it's not much, just working away as a line cook at a slapdash BBQ joint for $225 in a good week-- but it's definitely something. I've also built and grown my own businesses, Riflemans Cadence (pro-liberty online merchandise store) and Wingspan Graphics (custom logos & graphics design). Again, all this sweat and all these long, sleepless nights bring in a grand total of $1.6-2k/mo, and that's not easy to live on...but it's getting me somewhere: it's paid off my car already (which will take off a big burden), and since I'm still living with my parents, all my income except gas, insurance and Dollar Tree supplies is going straight into my savings.

 

I aim to get hired as a hostess at a nice restaurant (as it's illegal for me to waitress at a place that serves alcohol until I turn 18...don't get me started or so help me I'll go on another full bore anti-State rant) or, better yet, get hired by a local print shop, within this next couple months. I'll work that like a fiend until I can move out and transfer to an even better paying job, living on my two businesses and the $20k I aim to save up (I'm at $11k now) while I'm moving and between jobs. I'm also heading out of CA and into OR, where it's much less expensive to live.

 

While I can't be 100% certain that I'm on the right track (and not being well supported by my parents from whom I will probably de-FOO, though that's another talk for another time), I'm confident, hopeful, happy and open to any advice anybody might wish to offer me. Thanks again, everyone!

[Melissa McWilliams]

Update pt. II: After a few more months' working, exploration of self knowledge (soul searching, if you will), and talking with coworkers and a couple of friends, I've decided to trade security for freedom; in other words, I decided to quit working foodservice, retail, etc. and try my hand as a full-time freelancer. I figured that the 20-30 hours I spent making minimum wage, doing absolutely nothing of importance or value (which, frankly, was humiliating), could be infinitely better spent investing in my business.

 

Being a "nobody" employee did have its advantages, though: I learned a lot about customer service, was able to bring in steady pay and build my savings, and also saw firsthand the very position in life I didn't want to end up in, under any circumstance. Even since I wrote the post above, I've gained a LOT of self respect, which I didn't possess before.

 

I'm almost to the end of day one of no longer being on a payroll, and it feels good. I'll post another update within a few months.