On The Looming Federal 'Helium' Reserve Cliff (No, Really!)

[Guest Don C]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-08-27/looming-federal-helium-reserve-cliff-no-reallyDoes anyone know anything about this?I heard about it a while ago, but it slipped my mind.I am interested in a principled solution, or at least what the near term fallout is going to be. 

I think this could trigger some price inflation. Since helium is used in tech manufacturing.

 

I personally do not agree with 'if it moves or doesn't move, privatize it.'  I find that concept un-libertarian, to say the least, since it wouldn't be homesteaded. In reality, it would be sold to a crony, or setup as a public utility, by a state which doesn't have rightful ownership in the first place. And in this case, I don't think there is a 'market' to fill in the loss of production.

 

Would the feds be right to repeal the 'privatization' law?

[ribuck]

You don't need to worry about helium. Like the article says, helium is abundant although at the moment it is too expensive to extract it except from natural gas.

 

There is a boom in natural gas at the moment, which is likely to continue for at least a few decades. If the natural gas runs out, the price of helium will rise a bit and people will find a practical way to extract it from sources other than natural gas.

 

When I was a child in the 1960s, people were worrying about an imminent helium shortage, but look where we are now! Helium is sufficiently cheap and plentiful that it isn't even effectively captured and re-used.

[Guest Don C]

Thanks for replying ribuck

I've been thinking about your reply for a day.

I thought about ignoring your comments. But I expect more from a long-time listener.

And for the sake of being upfront and honest, I'll tell ya, you made bad first impression.

Is this a test? Or did you pat me on the head and tell me not to worry my pretty little face about it? That's how i feel.

When I was a child..... totally rediculous. Want me to tell you a story?

Do you know why helium is important?

Do you know anything about the helium reserve?

Did you look for any more stories about it?

Would you mind sending me some info as to why it is not something to 'worry' about?

Nat gas, why is the 'boom' likely to continue? You mean the bakken and marcel(lus shale fields? fracking?) parentheses an edit

 

My main concern with the helium reserve issue, is that I think it could cause price infaltion.

A cost-push price inflation.

This article gives some details:

http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/2013/05/helium-reserve-supply-shortage-price-rise

 

If there is anyone else on this forum, whom like me is not a billionaire, maybe holding a little cash

waiting to deploy it into something tangible, and is looking for trigger events of price inflation,

then I would suggest looking into the helium issue.

 

I think for sure it is going to cause trouble. Even though I think congress will repeal the law.

Edited August 29, 2013 by Don C

[ribuck]

I'm sorry you found my post unsatisfying, Don. Unfortunately, I don't know how I can fix that. I just don't think the politics surrounding the helium reserve are very important. A rise in the market price of helium will cause an increase in recycling, an increase in extraction, and an increase in private reserves (held by speculators). It's a self-repairing "problem".

[Guest Don C]

ribuck,

First off, I don't believe that your response was malicious.

But like I said, I expect a little more rigorous thought from a long-time FDR listener. (I assume long-time)

 

I am going to use this opportunity to possibly gain a little self-knowledge.

A forum topic about helium may seem trivial.

I may just be being a jerk. But you're missing my point.

I believe that since helium isn't just used in birthday balloons, this may affect the quality of life for us lowly serfs.

Most especially, the ones that live on the thirld world tax farms. The ones that riot when food prices go up.

I didn't find your initial reply un-satisfactory, I found it silly.

The second reply appears to me to have ignored my first and second. Which is insulting. Putting problem in qoutes...

I will parse it out. Maybe an objective third party will analyze this conversation and set me straight.

 

In both of my posts, I thought that I made clear that my concerns were near-term consequences and price inflation.  A fact that you

have simply ignored, yet felt the need to add your two cents to the thread. Two cents you can read off the back of an economics cereal box.

I'll get to that unclear thinking soon enough. I thought that my second post was pretty confrontational, and your response to it, I believe,

was worse than the first!

 

You don't need to worry about helium. A statement of fact which could never be proven, plus do you mean me personally?

 

Like the article says, helium is abundant although at the moment it is too expensive to extract it except from natural gas. Yeah, I posted it. Never mind the fact that the article contained not much more information than a headline. Which is why I posted a link to another with more information. And more importantly suggested doing a quick search to find more information for yourself.

 

There is a boom in natural gas at the moment, which is likely to continue for at least a few decades.

If the natural gas runs out, the price of helium will rise a bit and people will find a practical way to extract it from sources other than natural gas.

I believe that you brought up nat gas because there is helium in some of it. I'll get to this when I talk about the your 'market' solutions.

 

When I was a child in the 1960s, people were worrying about an imminent helium shortage, but look where we are now!  Absurd statement, but of course ignores my concern of price inflation.

 

Helium is sufficiently cheap and plentiful that it isn't even effectively captured and re-used. Again, a regurgition of the article, and horrible economics.

 

I just don't think the politics surrounding the helium reserve are very important I'm not sure about this one. But, from what I've read, the new storage facilites would probably be built in Qatar and/or Russia. My opinion is that relying on stabilty in the mid-east is foolish, and Russia already has Europe by the balls with nat gas, so there could possibly be poltical implications. Perhaps the UN could be in charge.

 

I'm sorry you found my post unsatisfying, Don. In my opinion, the name should come first, so as to not sound condescending.

 

A rise in the market price of helium will cause an increase in recycling, an increase in extraction, and an increase in private reserves (held by speculators). It's a self-repairing "problem".  This is the best part. Pure madness, in my opinion. I gotta break it down:

 

recycling from where? Labs, chip manufacturers? I've read that some systems exist. Some. Many more would be needed. I guess the time, energy, and resources needed mean nothing. Good old broken window fallacy never dies.

an increase in extraction from where? The sun? They extract helium from nat gas. As far as I know, to increase helium, you would need to increase nat gas extraction. And do what with the excess nat gas, burn it off like they do in the Bakken shale fields?

private reserves (held by speculators) This is a real knee slapper. No, I think it's outright delusional. Private reserves held by speculators, what planet are you on? Who has access to cheap capital? Who can get the permits? Where the hell is there a free market? Some c4ss.org guys talk about capitalism 1,2,3, & maybe now 4&5. I don't think that's capitalism 1. (cap 1 being what ancaps mean when they use the term capitalism) It's kind of like, I think, you are conflating (Roderick Long term: conflationism) the free market with existing capitalism. If you don't know what I'm talking about, then, in my opinion, you're dangerous to those of us who want free markets. Again, my opinion, like Milton Friedman. Start another thread in the economics if you want me to post some links about that.

 

It's a self-repairing "problem" Problem in qoutes...condescending. douchebag like. In my opinion.