Man Hopping Part 3: Closure

[MysterionMuffles]

Hey guys, I was wondering what your thoughts would be on this final goodbye letter I'm planning to write to this woman I've spent a lot of time with this year. The briefest summary I can surmise is that this a woman I wanted to have a platonic friendship with, but I unfriended due to being lead on, as well as conflicting religious and relationship views. Within the spoiler button is a more detailed account of our backstory if you'd like to know more without  having to go to the other threads I posted about this.

 

 

I refriended a woman who I always thought was interesting, but just had a bad habit of dating one man after the other, without so much of a pause between relationships. It was so bad that before even breaking up with her current boyfriend, she would be building up a relationship with another guy through some emotional infidelity, and when she felt comfortable enough with the new guy, the last guy would get dropped like a brick. Three years ago, one of those guys were my former friends and even though I didn't like him, I disliked her 10x more for having done a crappy thing to him. So despite of our individual friendship, I couldn't stand for that.

 

Fast forward to this year, I felt like I never really showed her much of who I really was and that I never took the time to really understand her. Apart from that bad habit of Man Hopping that she has, I've always enjoyed talking to her about a variety of things. For a while I thought it was great to have her as a platonic friend, I was glad she had a good boyfriend when I first started hanging out with her, but eventually she started to complain about how unsatisfactory he was becoming. So it got to the point where I felt like she was stringing me along as the next guy to hop onto, but thanks to a ton of self knowledge and introspection, not to mention an increase of self esteem, I managed to resist the urge to simply fall for her tricks. Especially since I've been single for 6 years now, I knew that being with her beyond friendship into a romantic relationship would only spell out disaster because of how conscious I am of her habits.

 

So I RTR'd with her a couple months ago, a month after breaking up with her initial boyfriend and moving ever so quickly onto another man. It was a fruitful conversation and I learned that at some point in our friendship and during a small window of time in which she was single, she actually wanted to get with me, but felt like she wasn't enough for me. Yeah to my surprise, she felt intimidated by philosophical knowledge and emotional stability, and ultimately unworthy of my affections if we were to get into a relationship. Not to be too boastful, but that's the way I saw it too, that she was beneath me in a way (which could've easily got me to have her LITERALLY beneath me HEYOOO!!! lol... ) and that felt a little arrogant to me. I knew that there was a hole in my approach with her so I decided to explore it with her.

 

I also had to admit that I was holding off from telling her that I liked her because I was afraid she would have done the same thing to me, you know suck up all the goodness of our relationship while she can, but move onto another if I was becoming uninteresting to her. It also goes without saying that I was intimidated by all of her sexual experience. A part of me only wanted to get with her out of desparation and some strange white-knight-hero complex I've been dealing in my life, so I knew that the basis of it would not spell for a fruitful relationship.

 

At the end of our conversation, we were on friendly terms and she suggested to me that I should spend a few months away from her and come back to her when I'm ready to be friends again. That was August, and here at the end of October I just can't shake the feeling away that despite of how much of a good friend she could be even if she was a dude, that she conflicts with some of my values on relationships and religion. Don't worry about me examining why I would even begin to be attracted to a woman like this. I wasn't physically initially, but the more time I spent with her, I did entertain the thought a bit. I've explored where this comes from and I'll spare the details since this is already so damn long.

 

Anyways if you took the time to read this section, thank you very much! I appreciate it as I'm sure it'll be more helpful to understand this before giving me your insight.

 

 

Below is the letter I want to write to her , but haven't decided on sending yet. I'm wondering if it's worth doing at all or if I should just leave it that: Official in person defriending (that was supposed to be temporary), then removing her from my Facebook list a couple months later. 

 

A part of me feels like she deserves an explanation but I'm not sure if it's the right thing to do. Like am I so disposable to her that it won't matter, or she really did value as a friend and she would appreciate the honesty?

 

Goodbye, [Man Hopper's Name]. Thanks for the good times this year, it was nice getting to know you better! I am surprised by the many things we opened up about to each other and it felt great to be able to be vulnerable at that level. I am really sorry for your history with your parents (they are strict Catholics who shamed the hell out of her for her sexual drive), and what happened to you back in the Philipines (she got raped by her cousin), even right now I feel sad thinking about it all. I thank you for your vulnerability and being able to put that trust in me. It meant a lot to me for you to let me know that I can be trusted with very sensitive information. I really hope that I didn't come off as too judgemental and that I offered you the right kind of empathy on those things.

 

But unfortunately, there were aspects of what I've discovered about you that conflicted with my core values. That's not to say that I want to write you off as a horrible person or anything, you're not. I think you're cool and really easy to talk to, but it was sometimes too easy as if you wanted to avoid disagreements in order to not upset me. I could be wrong, but it felt like there were many times I knew you didn't agree with me on a few things, and it would have been nice if you'd be honest and tell me instead of leading me to believe I was always right lol.

 

Anyways, I just can't help but feel a little irritated when I think about some of our interactions. I'm not holding you accountable for the way I feel, I'm just saying that after a few exchanges we've had, there's an irritation I feel that may really have nothing to do with you. But as it stands, I don't know how I would feel about us being friends again the same way. In particular when I asked you if knowing how we felt about each other at some point in time changes everything and you said no, it just felt like that was one of those things I wish you gave me more honesty about. 

[MysterionMuffles]

Ok I guess I won't send the letter after all lol

 

I guess I should just cut my ties with her and move on right? Like what does it matter if she understands me or not, I could care less for her opinion anymore.

[cynicist]

 

Three years ago, one of those guys were my former friends and even though I didn't like him, I disliked her 10x more for having done a crappy thing to him. So despite of our individual friendship, I couldn't stand for that.

 

Fast forward to this year, I felt like I never really showed her much of who I really was and that I never took the time to really understand her.

 

Not to make light of your situation but this part made me literally laugh out loud. It's like, "My friend totally betrayed me by having sex with my girlfriend, which was a really crappy thing to do, and I just couldn't stand for it. Fast forward to this year and I felt like I never showed him much of who I really was and never took the time to really understand him." Sounds like you just entered bizzaro world and everything white is now black. (could be just a lack of info on my part)

 

Also it feels strange to me that you want to explain yourself to her after defriending her. I know that if I had a friend I cared about and they decided to defriend me and stop talking to me I would absolutely want to find out why, so the fact that you don't mention her reaching out to you is noteworthy. (again maybe a lack of info)

 

The whole situation seems odd to me, as if I'm missing a big part of a puzzle, namely the motivation for a relationship with this woman. I mean I noticed you didn't say a single positive thing about her, not that you should have. Sounds like it's all about understanding her and her problems, and trying to get where she is coming from, so that you can try to change her through your sage advice. (and prove to her that you have value because of your wisdom, so that she won't get bored and dispose of you)

 

I don't want to project (this sounds similar to my own history) but does any of this remind you of your relationship with your mother? (having to prove your worth, trying to fix crazy, being focused on her needs over your own, trying to connect with someone who isn't very empathetic) To be clear I don't mean anything oedipal, just that you may be acting out certain parts of your past.

[MysterionMuffles]

Yeah she's not reaching out to me, so I know where my disposability lies. You're right though, it is kind of crazy that I had this need to prove to her I'm a good guy even though I've always had a bad opinion of her. Childhood recreations at the works man...

 

The fact that I FOUND OUT I was trying to change and control her is the reason why I couldn't stay friends with her. I would be fine hanging out with her normally, but when she unloaded her problems, a part of me wanted to understand why she's so retarded and that maybe she just needs the empathy she's never gotten outside of a romantic relationship. Playing this white knight friendzone role if you wanna go that far. I was highly aware of what I was doing. I could've banged her any time I was with her lol, but no way am I losing my virginity to someone who lost their at like 13 or 14. 

 

But yeah Cynicist, it was a bit of a recreation of my relationship with my mother. They're both irrational, dogmatic women with no clear understanding of themselves, nor of what they want in romantic relationships. I kept wanting to save this friend of mine from shitty relationships without having to lock her in one with me, which is really weird, so the whole situation was just too out of my hands to hold onto. It really is a bizzaro world, chose not to send any letter in the end and just unfriended her. If I meant anything to her, she'll message me about it. I highly doubt it though. She's happy playing future mommy with her new boyfriend and his son (that was a result of his exgirlfriend raping him, or taking the condom or something weird like that), while also trying to ward off the crazy baby mama.

 

Where would I fit in in her world of dysfunctions? Nowhere. And I'm fine with that. 

[cynicist]

I've been there with the white knighting an immature, overly sexual hot chick thing. It's like I knew she had nothing good to offer, but she was hot and I thought I could turn her into what I wanted. Almost like here is a good clay base, certainly I can work it into a masterpiece with the right combination of words. I was naive and assumed that since I changed my own mind with new info that she was capable of the same.

 

I just want to assure you that your judgment is sound and nothing you said would have changed anything. (and jesus from that last bit you mentioned I think you seriously matrix dodged that one)

[MysterionMuffles]

oh wow yeah that was another huge aspect as to why I had to disengage from this. I was recognizing that I was trying to shape her into an Atheist/Anarchist, when all along she just agreed to anything I said even if she disagreed later...but didn't have the damn guts to. I'm starting to see how she had attracted the other guys. Just submissive agreements to feed their narcissism that's influenced by her own narcissism.

 

LOL and thanks for the Matrix dodge comment, that made my day!

[tasmlab]

Ok I guess I won't send the letter after all lol

 

I guess I should just cut my ties with her and move on right? Like what does it matter if she understands me or not, I could care less for her opinion anymore.

 

This sounds right.  The only reason to invest so much explanation in a 'see ya later' is probably to do some hail mary to get her back/in the swing.  (casual observation from stranger on the internet).

 

Converting someone to anarchy/atheism also sounds like a rough nugget to put into an early relationship.  But then we all know that we've picked a tough road.  Political views don't matter much, IMO, since studying politics is a hobby.

[CrazyCanuck]

I've been with a woman something like that.  We fell in love first but we fought and didn't talk for a long time.  She did eventually reply to me because she had nothing else in her life.  We called each other in the beginning.  I didn't love that way I used to, just as friend.  We talked for a long time and after her I think it was her 3rd boyfriend she told me she loved me.  I told I love her as a friend only.  She claimed to be my best friend yet she stopped calling once she was dating a new guy just a few weeks telling she loves me.  She no longer puts efforts to contact me.  Unless I contact her she won't even email.  I didn't even say anything why would I need to?

 

My advice stop white knighting people especially women.