Jump to content

Feel free to ask me about anything in Islam

iron

By iron
in Atheism and Religion

 Share

Recommended Posts

iron Newbie

iron

Posted
  • Author
Posted

You know what... I just spent a bunch of time researching what Islam says about raising children.  It absolutely advocates hitting children, but I confess it also recommends and provides a vast list of rules and regulations and other stipulations.  For example, you aren't suppose to hit them until they are 7.  Sounds like a mild improvement on Judaism and Islam.

 

Perhaps Idris you can share your own childhood experiences with us... I'd be very interested to know how you and/or your siblings were disciplined as children. 

 

Here's an islamic lecture you can watch on parenting

 

I fast forward the timer to the exact spot where the Imam explicitly states that violence is not the answer

 

http://youtu.be/dm9tunwFFgs?t=32m41s

Link to comment
Share on other sites
LifeIsBrief Newbie

LifeIsBrief

Posted
Posted

Just for fun...

 

"It's okay, I know that the idea of doing a spiritual ritual can sound crazy, medieval, bizarre... etc. especially when you never tried it or experienced its outcome.

 

If you want to see empirical evidence, why not try it?  Experiment and see the results"

 

Literally a billion people are trying to put this philosophy into practice...  Why isn't it working?  That's as empirical as it gets.  If great knowledge and wisdom can be gained from these endeavors, why aren't Muslims the billion most productive, inventive, educated, and influential people on the planet, especially if you picked the right creator?

 

From the perspective of an atheist, and Buddhish person such as myself, the answer is clear.  The root of suffering is ignorance, and confusion.  So, the methods being employed by this particular group of people, are incorrect and do not lead to happy and productive lives.  This is also why, in my humble opinion, atheists have a particular distaste for this faith.  It makes incredible claims, and they are proven, not to functionally work in this reality.  How does a believer reconcile this problem?

 

I don't have a particular distaste for Islam, I don't even see a problem with deism, because I try not to waste time arguing for or against claims that are impossible to prove.  Buddhism doesn't work out incredibly well either, Tibet is constantly in a struggle to survive, which is part of the reason I say Buddhish.  I find all dogma to be distasteful, still... it blows my mind, that this particular faith continues to recruit, and grow in number, when every state linking this philosophy to their nation, is constantly falling into self destruction, even faster than all the other horrible and self destructive states in the world.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Josh F Newbie

Josh F

Posted
Posted

This site is dedicated to peaceful parenting and I don't want to put undo pressure, but instead of defending your ideology maybe you'd find your time here better spent learning about the rest of us.  After all, you came here, we didn't go visit a muslim forum.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
iron Newbie

iron

Posted
  • Author
Posted
Literally a billion people are trying to put this philosophy into practice...  Why isn't it working?  That's as empirical as it gets.  If great knowledge and wisdom can be gained from these endeavors, why aren't Muslims the billion most productive, inventive, educated, and influential people on the planet, especially if you picked the right creator?

 

As to why it isn't working, it depends on what angle you're looking at it.

If it has to do with none material issues (like intution, passion, relationships, spritituality, knowledge ...etc.), many argue that it does work.

 

But if it is with material, worldly issues...

 

Perhaps because they're not following the Creator's law as closely as possible when it comes to worldly issues?

For example in countries where the majority are muslim, their currency of choice is a usury-bearing IOU debt, and usury is against the teachings of Islam.  Or even in the case when they do get an abundance of wealth (like the saudis) instead of investing it into factories, R&D projects, ..etc. they decide to use it to compete with one another in constructing the tallest buildings, or building big luxurious mosques, ..etc. which in Islam is looked down upon and is known as "Israf".

 

People have free will, and these are the choices that some muslims make.

 

You also have countries like Iran who want to grow their economy, but they can't because of global imposed sanctions and threats against them, because the rest of the world trades in USDs (because the wahabies demand it), and so the rest of the world has to conform to what US demands if they want to get oil for their own polutation.

 

So some of these issues have to be dealt with if they want to see material success.

 

I also want to point out that there was a period of time where the muslim world was flourishing, expanding in fields like science, math, ...etc.

and it came to an end when they were distracted with wars with the crusades, the mongouls and even internal conflicts where independent reasoning was discouraged.

My question would be what is the difference between Christianity and Islam. Both have a savior that says if you "believe" enter the gates of heaven. Right? Or am I completely wrong? I know little on the subject.

 

What we agree is that Jesus-pbuh was the long-awaited Messiah for the jews, but they rejected him and so a few years after he left them, the second temple was demolished, the land dried up and once again they were forced to go into exile from their land in accordance to the Creator's laws

 

What we disagree is that, Jesus is not the Creator nor the son of the Creator, but he is a human being and a Prophet, the Messiah

the term "son of Creator" in roman times meant a king, or someone very influential, it was a figuirative term

but some how when the original works for the NT was translated into other languages, people took the word literally as opposed to figuiratively

 

In regards to heaven/hell

I don't know much about a savior in heaven, perhaps you want to talk about it with an Imam?

We do however believe that at some point near Judgement Day, we'll have a righteous leader

who'll help bring justice to a very corrupt world that is ruled by pharoh-like individuals who have no empathy whatsoever.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...
LanceD Newbie

LanceD

Posted
Posted

I'm not going to do any of that stuff, what an absurd and incredibly insulting request. You think I haven´t experienced religious absurdity in my life? Do you think atheists are all raised on some island where crazy people can't come? We know how prayer works, we've seen it and done it, it doesn't work, we all know it doesn't work, and you know it doesn't work.Let me explain what you're doing: talking to yourself, looking for coincidences, and then using that irrelevant activity to justify your belief in an abusive space overlord who you'll abuse children into worshiping. Please do not request anyone on this forum practice Islam, that's horrific. This is a forum against irrationality and child abuse, making it the opposite of Islam.

I'm sorry but when I read this post I couldn't help but quote it. This is one of the greatest things ever written on this forum and everyone needs to know this. On topic. To the OP, why does your religion produce so many violent psychopaths?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
iron Newbie

iron

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Why do you believe, that quran which states, that it is the word of god, is really the word of god, when there are other texts, which also state, they are the word od god, you don't believe it is the word of god?

 

The Quran is different in the sense that it is poetic and short, which makes it easy for one to memorize it. Many muslims dedicate tremendous time and effort to memorize every chapter. So whether it is written down or not, the message stays in tact.  It was frivolous for tyrants in the past to collect all the texts and burn them or alter them in any way, because many of the muslims had it memorized which kept the islamic religion alive during those early chaotic years.  The tyrant rulers of that era went after the religion in another way, by hijaking it and claiming they too are devout followers-- however the Prophet's family pledge no alligence to them because of their corrupt rulership.  His grand sons paid the painful price of martydom to keep the religion from being distorted by the tyrant rulers (

).

 

***

 

As for the other holy text, Islam does promote the idea to study the OT, NT and other ancient texts/scrolls.  But we believe their messages have been distorted, or additional rules were added which were incorrect.

 

As an example I mentioned before, in the NT, when it was translated into other languages, the roman term 'son of god' which meant a high level king, was translated as the literal phrase son of god.  We do not belive Jesus is the son of god (and any part of trinity), we simply belive he's a prophet and the Messiah for the Jews.

 

In the case of jews, they added stricter rules and punishments to their books which were unnecessary and not ordained by the Creator.

 

The Quran came to correct what was added or corrupted.

 

Also the choice of words used in the Quran is very similar to the texts of eastern religions like the dharma.

 

 

 

How do you "know" that Muhammad has really listened to an angel?

If there are other prophets, - and there are countless-, who also say they have listened to god/angels, why do you believe Muhammad and not the other prophets?

 

For one, if you read the arabic Quran you would just know it was not written by a  human.

Many of the top arabic poets of that era, when it first was revealed to the general public, were bewildered by the style of the poetic verses as it was recited by an individual who had no formal training in poetry.

If you time, I suggest you listen to a few chapters to experience it yourself.  Here are the last 3 short chapters http://youtu.be/2AygBGy7FB4

Here are other longer ones, http://youtu.be/SW1UoZ_Jk68 and http://youtu.be/watch?v=y9j8R3Jf6nQ.

 

Muslims do accept all Prophets of the Creator - we believe that there were something like 124000 prophets of them sent to every region on the planet, guiding the people to what is just, truthful, moral, ...etc. 

But unlike the others, Prophet Muhammed-saww has given us the message (Quran) which has not been altered/corrupted since it was first revealed.

 

 

Do humans, who lived before Muhammad or never heard of him also go to hell?

 

It depends on how he/she conducted themselves while they were on earth.  Did he commit injustice, cheat others, was he a tyrant, cruel opressor?  All deeds will be accounted,and it will be decided which path they go in the next life they'll go.

 

 

What would your life look like if you were are kafir?

How would your family react? Your social enviroment?

 

I'm not sure what you mean by this question.

 

if I was born a kafir, I'm pretty sure I would make an effort to find explanation and truths to matters that may not be explainable on the surface

 

for example coincidental experiences, or incredible vivid/lucid dreams and deja vus,

 

I'm sure in my pursuit of researching these topics, I would eventually find spirituality and religion.

 

***

 

This leads me to another point, in that I suggest you try out the early morning prayer and experience for yourself the spiritual effects it causes in your life.  Or attend a local chanting (zikr) session and see what effect the few days after.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
zippert Newbie

zippert

Posted
Posted

Thank you for answering my questions.

The Quran is different in the sense that it is poetic and short,

"poetic" :http://www.thefreedictionary.com/poeticpoetic is a term refering to an artistic way of writing. So it is about text quality, which is not objective. If there are objective criterias for "poetic", roll them out. The Quran is not the shortest text that claims it is by god. There only the sentence "this is from god" needed. So if someone gets to be a good poet (in your sense) and writes a shorter, poetic text with an opposing religion, are you going to convert? 

For one, if you read the arabic Quran you would just know it was not written by a  human.Many of the top arabic poets of that era, when it first was revealed to the general public, were bewildered by the style of the poetic verses as it was recited by an individual who had no formal training in poetry.

Where does "formal poetic education" come from? There has to be someone who was considered a poet first time, who first gives out this education. How do you know that the prophet was not one of them? And how do you know that he had no education, since he was a merchant and therefore had to have speeking skills? 

It depends on how he/she conducted themselves while they were on earth.  Did he commit injustice, cheat others, was he a tyrant, cruel opressor?  All deeds will be accounted,and it will be decided which path they go in the next life they'll go.

 If it is true that everybody who has heard of Muhammad and the Quran is going to hell if he doesn't believe his message, and they would not go to hell if they haven't heard of him but lived a good life anyway, then you are sending people to hell by telling them about Islam, aren't you?

I'm not sure what you mean by this question.

I mean: What would happen to you, if you openly declare yourself a kafir(convert).

if I was born a kafir, I'm pretty sure I would make an effort to find explanation and truths to matters that may not be explainable on the surface

Is it possible that you are threatened with violence if you not believe and therefore your perseption of truth is corrupted?See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Lowe D Newbie

Lowe D

Posted
Posted

I'm more interested in answer to the questions I asked (not in bold).

 

I'm sorry, I can't talk about it at this time, and it can be a distraction for this thread.

Maybe some other time.

 

I too am interested in hearing about your childhood.  Would it be so much of a distraction, in this thread, which already seems so scattered?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...
Tenko Newbie

Tenko

Posted
Posted

Posted ImagePosted Image

 

I heard that Muslims make traditional trips to a holy city (Mecca?) and worship en mass around this black building. I also heard that only 'high Muslim priests', or whatever the correct term is, are allowed to enter this building, and that no one else is allowed to see what is inside. I'd be curious to know what is inside. :cool:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
 Share
Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.

  I accept