Holiday Blues?

[MysterionMuffles]

Does anybody get bluesy around the Christmas season? Or is it just another time of year like any other? (Whether you've gotten over initial Holiday Blues or was just never a big deal for you to begin with)

[Freedomain]

We're doing a show on Christmas Eve (12/24 Tuesday) at 8pm Eastern specifically to discuss this kind of thing.  If anybody would like to participate, just shoot me an email at [email protected] and I'll get you scheduled in.

[Kevin Beal]

Seasonal affect "disorder" is often used to describe this (apparently common) phenomena.

 

My personal perspective on it is that it's the time when family is obligated to spend time with each other. What this meant in my family was a lot of soft put downs, active indifference, painfully dull conversation, one-upmanship, passive aggression and a big ol' serving of avoidance plopped on top.

[Mike Fleming]

Ooohhh, don't like the medical disorder description for it at all.  But I guess everyone is "supposed" to be happy at this time and so if you aren't there is "something wrong with you".  I wonder how many people are truly happy though.  I think the number of people putting on a brave face is likely to be significant if not a majority of the population.

 

But yeah, same here, can't remember genuinely enjoying Christmas family time.  Just dredges up bad memories more than anything else.  I prefer to be able to not need special dates to enjoy and appreciate life.  

 

And having good will to all men?  I guess the rest of the year you don't have to be nice...   Reminds me of the WW1 thing where the enemies all shook hands at XMas time and then blew bits off each other the rest of the year.  Because hey, you have to be nice at Christmas time...  The rest of the time?  Doesn't really matter so much.

[Omega 3 snake oil]

I hear there's a spike in suicides over the holidays.  Me, I just refuse to see people I don't see at other times of the year and spend lots of time with those I do. And booze of course:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wvmi2xCoT_8

[PatrickC]

Yeah, I always remember a shits and giggles skype call Stef made in xmas 2008. It was very kind of him to do that at what was quite an isolated moment in my life.

 

I'm spending xmas with a great fdr friend of mine, but will try and listen to the show if we're up early enough.

[Magnus]

I hate Christmas. I want to enjoy it, but I don't.

 

I live in Florida, so I can't ascribe it to Seasonal Affective Disorder. I'm not even bothered by the religiosity, even though I'm a stone atheist. (I just don't argue with them. One of the few benefits of having my particular parents was their total lack of religion. They weren't philosophical about it. Just indifferent to religion.)

 

The reason I hate it is because my childhood Christmas experiences were almost entirely negative. Shame, pressure, expectation, disappointment. My mother was a modern artist. She didn't cook. Minimal maternalism. But my sisters always wanted the Norman Rockwell life, which expressed itself as a shallow materialism, especially around the holidays. The result was a constant tension between feeling obligated to have a Winter Wonderland preppy New England-y time filled with egg nog and garland and sweaters and Bing Crosby tunes, and reality which was usually grocery store coffee cake and a lot of hurt feelings.

 

And, as the FDR community would fully understand, I'm in a marriage where Christmas is filled with pressure and unmet expectations, followed by an annual divorce announcement from my wife every December 26th. It's awful.

[Mike Fleming]

What do people think of the whole Christmas cards thing?  You know, the "let's send a card to all these people that I hardly know/met once/don't particularly like/ hate their guts/etc".   Just basically so you can have a mantle full of cards.    Look at all my friends and family... 

 

I've never done it personally.  It seems very similar to the people who have hundreds of Facebook "friends". 

[PatrickC]

I don't mind the cards personally.. People are often busy, like myself and live far away.. It seems a nice gesture I think regardless of the actual value of xmas itself.

[MysterionMuffles]

Cards are worthless, no one even reads them. Some of them have nice messages in them. As for pictures of their own friends and family as cards, I've never seen that happen in my circle of people.

I'm really sorry you had to go through that, Magnus.

[Wesley]

Here is a Jim Gaffigan skit where he makes fun of holiday traditions.

 

One was the greeting card thing.

 

 

Aw, that one ended too soon..

 

Watch this one @ 0:52

 

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2423561/jim_gaffigan_valentines_day_and_greeting_cards/

[PatrickC]

Cards are worthless, no one even reads them.

 

Really, you never read a card that someone posted to you?

[meeri]

What do people think of the whole Christmas cards thing?  You know, the "let's send a card to all these people that I hardly know/met once/don't particularly like/ hate their guts/etc".   Just basically so you can have a mantle full of cards.    Look at all my friends and family... 

There's perhaps more of that with birthday cards: look at all the people who remembered my birthday, they cared.. I think with Christmas people get into this continuous loop of they sent me a card so I need to send them a card so they will send me a card.. I doubt anybody puts a whole lot of thought into these.

 

As to holiday blues.. it's my first Christmas since defoo so I'm expecting some of it for sure. I'm even a bit excited to see what happens, it feels like a kind of milestone. I will definitely listen in on Christmas Eve.

[Holo Cene]

There's perhaps more of that with birthday cards: look at all the people who remembered my birthday, they cared.. I think with Christmas people get into this continuous loop of they sent me a card so I need to send them a card so they will send me a card.. I doubt anybody puts a whole lot of thought into these.

 

As to holiday blues.. it's my first Christmas since defoo so I'm expecting some of it for sure. I'm even a bit excited to see what happens, it feels like a kind of milestone. I will definitely listen in on Christmas Eve.

 

I hope you have a great Christmas. All of us are kindred spirits so you're never really alone. We are all just separated by distance is all.

[MysterionMuffles]

Really, you never read a card that someone posted to you?

Forgot to mention that I'm the exception. I used to read them out loud when it came to opening presents with the family. We go person by person.

 

This is why I write personal messages now instead of something pre-written in a card.

[Mike Fleming]

I don't mind the cards personally.. People are often busy, like myself and live far away.. It seems a nice gesture I think regardless of the actual value of xmas itself.

 

You know, I never got that feeling from receiving Christmas cards.  It just seems like an empty gesture to me.  Like I'm just on someone's mailing list and I have to send one in return if I want to remain on it.

 

I think Birthday cards are different and most people I know have a lot less Bday cards on their mantle than they do XMas cards.  And I think that says something.

[Mishelle]

Meeri, congrats on your defoo and wishing you well this xmas!

 

I spend the holidays alone for quite a few years now and at first it was difficult and I would say I felt sorry for myself a bit.  My husband works half the month offshore, and always works the holidays, and I stopped visiting family about 7 years ago or so because I just didn't enjoy it.  I had to start being honest with myself about that and take action.  Of course, that action had consequences to deal with!  I spend weeks sometimes without seeing anyone, because we live out in the country and are quite self-sufficient with food, so there's really no reason for me to even go into town.  At first I found this depressing, now I find it exhilarating.  I treasure my time alone as a great gift to cultivate myself, my interests, my health, my learning, my writing.  I know it sounds like a lot of "ME" lol, but by really getting deep with myself and nourishing myself in this way, I become a better person with others.  It makes it easier to stay true to my goals and focused on my intentions.

 

It's not that I don't get lonely, not at all, I do.  Then I use that loneliness as a jumping off point toward greater levels self-knowledge and compassion.  And when I can't stand it anymore, I go down to the city, rent a room, get a mani-pedi, cut-n-color, go to the ballet and shop all the next day.  Suddenly that feels like therapy too! Some things I used to totally take for granted is like a great treat!!!

 

Anyway, maybe this year I'll listen to Stef, yay!

Thanks for sharing on this, I'll be thinkin' of y'all and hoping any loneliness will lead to great depths of knowledge

[Wuzzums]

A friend of mine during the holidays whenever he met someone he said hello and added a quick "howhaveyoubeenhappyholidaysandahappynewyear bye". It saves a lot of time.

[Aikenrooster]

Yeah, I get the blues big time at Christmas, and usually it involves a lot of regret, for whatever reason.   I get really depressed because I couldn't or didn't buy people the things that I really wanted to buy them, and then I get more depressed because this happens every year.  I get depressed about how fast time flies by and that I never get to spend time with my family.  I get depressed about all the things that I've always wanted to do but I have never done.  

[Holo Cene]

Yeah, I get the blues big time at Christmas, and usually it involves a lot of regret, for whatever reason.   I get really depressed because I couldn't or didn't buy people the things that I really wanted to buy them, and then I get more depressed because this happens every year.  I get depressed about how fast time flies by and that I never get to spend time with my family.  I get depressed about all the things that I've always wanted to do but I have never done.  

 

That must suck man. A piece of hope I can give you, is that the self-work leads to better things. When you can integrate yourself and direct the course of your brain change through arduous work, commitment and dedication the changes will happen. This includes the things you want to do, as you grow the skill sets and the awareness, the opportunities and possibilities of the world open up to you. I would say the first step is embracing rejection and failure. Let them in, let their history fill your soul by embracing it in your present life. 

[meeri]

Thank you Holo Cene and Mishelle:) and a wonderful Christmas to you!

[Mishelle]

So I'm having some holiday blues now because there was no Sunday Stef mass yesterday.  hehe, just joking, I did miss him, but what really happened was I called my sister and she was having the whole family over and she passed the phone to my aunt, cousin, step-dad, mom before I had to stop.  Since then I am having some feelings I can't explain and feel I want to drown them out with projects and activity, so I know better that I need to stop and push into this more.  Thanks for reading, witnessing, trying to relate.

 

I do feel sad, and lonely, but it's not because I wanted to be there with them.  In fact, it was kinda torture to try to talk to them, my step-dad was drunk, as usual (at 2pm), my sis preoccupied (understandable), the chat with cousin and aunt forced and fake.  I don't want that!  And still, I don't want this either, not all the time anyway.  I do well with isolation now, much better than when we first came out here, and I really do like it a lot of the time.  I don't want to distract myself away from the discomfort, but at the same time I do understand it's probably not even healthy to be so used to being alone to such a degree.  I wonder if anyone here has been in the situation of prolonged solitude (except for internet, yay!). I could easily go 2 weeks seeing no one but the UPS driver!  Still I love spending my time exactly how I like with no schedule unless I want and answering to know one--it's like my own private Idaho--and it feels pretty luxurious because I've never had it before now.  Any reason I would find to go out seems shallow and pointless--shop? (yuk) take a drive? (where?) visit someone (who?) -- nothing sounds appealing and I know someone is going to say, "that sounds like depression" but I know it's not.  I'm very motivated and get lots done all day.  I've always been very driven to evolve and that has not changed, but now I feel this voice saying "Stop plowing through life! Stop pushing and just be!"  But it's really hard, standing still is much harder for me than moving.

 

So, I hear me sounding very ambivalent.  I feel such a pendulum swing sometimes about this.  Like: things are awesome as they are stop looking to change them and relax already!  And then:  things could be better, make some plans how to shift this extreme solitude or it will come back to haunt you!

 

Does anyone else have this experience?

[Lians]

Mishelle, what you're experiencing is what I like to call a FOO infection. I've identified two distinct patterns to this phenomenon - unprocessed history and emotional contagion. In your case, the unprocessed history would be related to why your sister isn't sensitive to your desire to stay away from the family, why you wanted to call her and so forth. Resolving it is a matter of focused questioning and examination on both emotional and philosophical levels.

 

Emotional contagion is the unconscious passing of emotion from one person to another. It's an automatic process that's built into us for adaptation, or even survival purposes. We are social species after all. You don't want to be happy and relaxed amidst an angry lynch mob. If anything, they'll single you out for acting differently.

 

I haven't found a way to counteract this tendency, and I don't think there is one. It's important that you recognize when an emotional contagion is taking place. The conscious identification will allow you to isolate the questionable feelings and trace their origin. Strategies for resolving contagion issues depend on your degree of self-knowledge. RTR-ing with yourself really helps. The only long-term solution is to decrease your exposure to dysfunctional people, parting ways with them if necessary. For example, that's one of the reasons why I don't associate myself with habitually negative people. They haven't abused me or done me wrong, but their negativity is passed onto me anyway.

 

My history and understanding of solitude is quite interesting. As a kid, I often yearned for solitude and was deeply suspicious of people who tried to portray it as negative. After school, I was usually thinking or reading alone in my room. On the other hand, as part of my activities and interests, I had to spend a lot of time around other people. I really struggled to reconcile the two social dynamics. I don't have a final solution, but I can tell you what works for me.

 

I feel a deep desire for solitude whenever I'm trying to identify and resolve a core issue within me. There are two main benefits to the isolation approach. First, if you no longer have the issue after distancing yourself from others, the cause is most likely external (i.e. emotional contagion). Isolation is a quick and effective way of nailing down probable causes. The second benefit is a bit more subtle. False-self-driven people around you will consciously or unconsciously try to sabotage you whenever they sense that you're breaking out of the mould. By the time you emerge from your self-knowledge cocoon, it will be too late for them to affect you.

 

After I've made some progress, I often feel a desire to put myself out there to evaluate how close I am to my goals. If things are the same and nothing's changed, I go back to the drawing board. To me, this solitude-socializing dynamic is an iterative process that is quite effective when it comes to gaining self-knowledge. I suspect things will change as I begin to introduce more positive people into my life. The desire to be alone in times of self-work will most likely diminish. In the long run, the whole process may smooth out and become more organic, allowing me to easily integrate it in my daily life. However, I won't relinquish my need for solitude until then!

 

Here are a few disclaimers and clarifications. Working with a therapist is just about the only exception I have for what I outlined above. My history with abuse is, in many ways, quite extreme, so this approach may not work for you. On the other hand, if it works for extreme cases, it may also help with less severe ones.

[meeri]

Hi Mishelle, thank you for sharing your experience. I am very sorry this time is bringing up some difficult emotions for you. All I can say is that I sympathise with your sadness and loneliness, and the fear of experiencing them.

 

Loneliness particularly, was something I wasn't allowed to experience as a child and something I repressed. In the last couple of weeks, as these feelings have come up, rather than avoiding them, I've tried to let myself experience them fully. These feelings carry a deep pain and heaviness, something I've never felt before but there was something in experiencing them that has made me feel relaxed and open in strange, new and positive way. 

 

I'm not sure if this is of any help at all but I hope you will find some clarity and best of luck.

[Mishelle]

Thank you lovely Meeri I really do hear what you're saying.  It's funny even after just posting that I did feel much better.  That's just it, maybe I'm so good at getting over it I never really process it fully.  But yes, to not avoid, I really feel that as most crucial. 

 

Ok Lians, wow!  You are so wise and well-spoken, with a photo that looks like you are what, 24, tops?!

More on all that coming!  Thanks though dear, very thought-provoking!

[Lians]

Ok Lians, wow!  You are so wise and well-spoken, with a photo that looks like you are what, 24, tops?!

More on all that coming!  Thanks though dear, very thought-provoking!

 

Come January, I'm turning 23. I've lead a pretty eventful life, so I feel older than I should be. It's a gift and a curse. Glad I could be of help, but my wisdom comes solely from philosophy. Keep ploughing through Stef's content and you'll reap the same benefits!