Standards of Success, from view of Abusive/Hyperreligious Mother

[creakins]

Hi Everyone,

 

I need some advice.  I've been on a self knowledge journey for many years now, and have decided to leave my job for a year and make a run at being an entrepreneur.  I am 31, and for the past two years I have lived with my parents because I wanted to pay off my large school debt, get healthy, and spend some quality time digging into some self knowledge work.

 

My mother is hyper religious.  The catholic type that spends four nights a week at Church.  She is also medicated for being bi-polar.  I never know what mom I am going to get from day to day.  She is either really happy, or really stressed and angry.  Growing up I had to deal with daily screaming and hitting.  When she found the Church at age 15, some of the screaming subsided, but then the fear tactics kicked in.   Her father was a drunk and an abuser, while her mother was institutionalized several times for mental breakdowns.  Her mother was also a screamer and a hitter.  I always try to understand and support her through her massive mood swings, but I don't think I can do it any longer.

 

My father, who still lives at home, has always been the "my way or the highway" kind of guy. As a teenager, I always tried to get him to take my side, but he protected my mother and said that I just had to do what I was told and stop making her mad (as if it was my fault).  It was a very difficult decision to move home two years ago, but with my looming debt, and my health drastically failing because I was not managing my own stress, eating habits, while I smoked a pack a day and drank to fall asleep.  I have since gone through a great deal of therapy and life style adjustments and I have never been healthier, happier, and mentally sound.  It was my father gave me the option two years ago, and said that my rent would help him retire, while I could live close to work and get healthy.

 

My rent didn't help him retire, instead it bought him a motorcycle and a couple of cruises.  At 71, he has no intention of retiring.  But here's the situation right now.  He supports me and says that no matter what decision I make in life I'll always be his son and will support my decisions.  I am the only one who can find happiness for myself.  To make this transition smooth, I asked if it was possible to lower my rent to just utilities ($300 a month) from $800.  When I explained to my mother why I was asking she lost her temper, said that I am just like her, bi-polar, and that this phase I'm just throwing away my secure job as a public school teacher.  I told her that it was irrational to project her label onto me without any empirical evidence.  The only truth to my situation is that I am working for something I do not believe in, and the past seven years in the school system has been trying.  She ended the conversation by saying that I was always just using them.  I kept my cool, and said that I would have hoped for a non-emotional extreme response and some parental advice and support.  She stormed off to her bedroom and I probably won't see or hear from her for a week.

 

I do not need their approval at all.  Reducing my rent would have been extremely helpful.  I'm thinking that the next 5 months I have to live here (proximity to work, and I have five months left on my contract at the school before I can move back down to the city) is going to really uncomfortable, but I might just give them what I can ($300) and if they decide to kick me out, the ties will naturally be cut.  What would someone do in this situation?

 

I'd appreciate any advice.

 

C

[dsayers]

When I explained to my mother why I was asking she lost her temper, said that I am just like her, bi-polar, and that this phase I'm just throwing away my secure job as a public school teacher.  I told her that it was irrational to project her label onto me without any empirical evidence.

 

Well, the condition doesn't require any empirical evidence, which is why the diagnosis itself is bogus. That's another topic altogether though.

 

We sound as if we're in similar situations with two major differences. When I first moved back home, I was pretty much bankrupt and virtually unemployable. Rent was never part of the equation even though once I was gainfully employed, I pretty much insisted upon it, but they refused. Anyways, I don't know where you are geographically, but where I'm at, if I could afford $800 a month, I wouldn't have to live under anybody specific's roof.

 

That said, if you had agreed to $800/mo, to not honor that while living there would be theft and therefor immoral.

 

I'm really sorry you're living in a place where you're not even allowed to be a person. It sounds like you've repaired yourself enough that it doesn't effect you too much, which is good. I'm there too. However, the reason I tolerate is because of the way it aides my ability to save money. It doesn't sound like this would be the case for you. Have you looked into what just having your own shitty apartment would cost you? Again, I don't know where you're at, but I'll bet you could find one and after utilities, be paying less than $800/mo. So you'd be saving money and the abuse.

 

Is that helpful at all?

[creakins]

Dsayers,

 

That really does help.  Thank you for your insight.  I didn't think about the immoral nature of not paying my parents the $800.  Currently, my mother is not talking to me, and after watching the Bomb and the Brain series again, I can see the effects of her being raised by two very abusive parents.  Its unfortunate that she is repeating the cycle with her kids, but it helps to put things in perspective.

 

As for leaving before that 5 months is up, I don't think that is a smart option.  There isn't a whole lot of inexpensive rentals in my little town, and its just too far from the city to make the move and continue to commute.  I will limit my communication as I have my own apartment, pay my bills in full and in time, and keep my nose to the grindstone when it comes to working and saving money to make my transition to entrepreneurship as smooth as possible.

 

Of course I won't avoid the abuse all together in the next 5 months, but I have been paying for therapy and will continue to work through it.  All I want is my health and happiness and I can see it clearly now, the road to it has a few pot holes that if I drive carefully enough, I'll avoid most of them.  Thank you for your advice.

 

c

[dsayers]

This raises a question in me that I would appreciate some insight into. I'm really sorry if it comes across as having implications as my inquiry is for the purpose of exploration.

 

I had considered sitting down with my father and asking for an arrangement of him letting me live here longer (2 years give or take) so that I could use the money I'm making to pay for therapy. I quickly abandoned the idea because I just assumed that any therapist worth their salt would tell me within the first few sessions that I need to get the hell away from active abusers before healing could properly begin. Any insight on this admittedly perceived conundrum would be appreciated. I'm skeptical because I'm all too familiar with the way my father in me can talk me out of things before giving them a proper go.

[LanceD]

You take plenty of time to explain what is wrong with your parents and why they are not good for you to be around. Yet when you list the reasons why you live there again you're talking about it like it's a good thing.

 

Why is this?

 

How does willingly living with and being at least partially supported by your abusers empower you to seek better self knowledge?

 

Imagine for a moment that you were a father of a young child. Would you live with your parents and expose an innocent child to the same abuse you suffered?

 

I would assume the answer is no, that you would do everything you could to not live with them and ruin your child's life in such a manner.

 

Then why are you willing to do such a thing to yourself?

 

Do you not deserve better?

 

Are all of the reasons you listed to live there not simply ways to justify this mistake to the voice in your head telling you its a bad idea?

 

I worry for you and the other men in this community who continue to live with their abusers. You all have a long list of reasons why but to me they all show a lack of confidence in yourself and a dependence on your abuser.

 

I wish you the best and hope I don't come off poorly. I'm just trying to provoke some thought and hopefully encourage you to put all of your energy towards getting the hell out of a bad situation.

[creakins]

This raises a question in me that I would appreciate some insight into. I'm really sorry if it comes across as having implications as my inquiry is for the purpose of exploration.

 

I had considered sitting down with my father and asking for an arrangement of him letting me live here longer (2 years give or take) so that I could use the money I'm making to pay for therapy. I quickly abandoned the idea because I just assumed that any therapist worth their salt would tell me within the first few sessions that I need to get the hell away from active abusers before healing could properly begin. Any insight on this admittedly perceived conundrum would be appreciated. I'm skeptical because I'm all too familiar with the way my father in me can talk me out of things before giving them a proper go.

 

Dsayers,

 

Being in the same situation, my decision was to leave for the sake of my physical and mental health.  I am working hard at healing, and discovering that the abuse I endure daily in my house is the one stopping point from achieving freedom.  I agree that any therapist would say that you need to remove yourself from the abusive relationship to heal.  There are therapists in the city that I am moving to (which I called home for my 20's) that do discounted sessions with clients who can't pay the full price.  I am sure you could find something like that if you looked hard and was honest about your finances up front.  I'm quickly learning, that saving money through taking advantage of my parents only comes at a cost.  The mental cost isn't worth the financial savings.  That is my opinion and why I am finally making the move, despite the fact that I will not be financially better off right away.  I'm hoping that 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration will balance the scales.

 

Keep me posted about what you decide.  And I hope my point of view helps.

[creakins]

You take plenty of time to explain what is wrong with your parents and why they are not good for you to be around. Yet when you list the reasons why you live there again you're talking about it like it's a good thing.Why is this?How does willingly living with and being at least partially supported by your abusers empower you to seek better self knowledge?Imagine for a moment that you were a father of a young child. Would you live with your parents and expose an innocent child to the same abuse you suffered?I would assume the answer is no, that you would do everything you could to not live with them and ruin your child's life in such a manner.Then why are you willing to do such a thing to yourself?Do you not deserve better?Are all of the reasons you listed to live there not simply ways to justify this mistake to the voice in your head telling you its a bad idea?I worry for you and the other men in this community who continue to live with their abusers. You all have a long list of reasons why but to me they all show a lack of confidence in yourself and a dependence on your abuser.I wish you the best and hope I don't come off poorly. I'm just trying to provoke some thought and hopefully encourage you to put all of your energy towards getting the hell out of a bad situation.

 

You have brought up a few really good points.  The reality is I'm afraid.  From what I've been learning, it can be a very difficult process to see that the abusive behavior isn't protective and builds dependance on the abuser.

 

Let me give you another example.  My mind is a little cloudy today because of a talk I had with my father last night.  He came down to my apartment to talk about my decision to take a leave from teaching.  To sum up what he said, the only measure of success that going out on my own and leaving my job in public education is whether or not I end up making more money than teaching to balance my current salary and the fact that I will be losing the government pension that I get as a teacher.  He then followed it up with saying that from my history as a teenager with anger problems, he doesn't feel like I am going to meet that success criteria.  I can go and try, but don't forget all the stuff my parents do for me.

 

This immediately got me thinking about how I am possibly going to make it without the security of this full time employment by the government.  It made me really nervous and had me second guessing my opinion to make the move on with my life.  The only two people in my world that don't support this decision are my parents.  After some serious reflection this is what I came up with.

 

From this example, I am aware that the abuse will continue to feed the self doubt.  I need to get away from it.  I am working at finding a way to do so where I can have the best foundation for success rather than acting without a well laid plan.  I want to be successful at what I transition into.  I know that I can do it.  If I leave right now and move to the city with five months of my contract left, financially I will be draining my reserves in rental costs and commuting expenses.  An increase of over $1150 a month if I can rent a bachelor apartment at $750 and gas prices not increasing at all over the next 5 months.   This means that I will not have any savings to buffer me through the start up phase of my new development come september.

 

Most of the time, my parents leave me alone, unless of course I initiate a conversation (like trying to get them in on my plan - knowing damn well that they were going to make me feel like I am going to fail at this venture).  I am not saying that the abuse is my fault, but at the same time, I do not need to communicate with them as I do have a separate apartment all together.

 

So no...  it doesn't help my situation mentally to subject myself to this kind of abuse.  Moving out without an action plan will only affirm their believes that I will fail.  Smartly planning my transition, and then executing it, although there is a great deal of risk, is how I will better my chances of success.

 

My father after letting me know his opinion said that they will lower my rent to help me succeed.  Its kind of like a punch in the belly followed by a popsicle to make me feel better.  I understand that his action was to reaffirm my reliance on him, but the one thing that he doesn't understand is that I saw the punch coming, dodged it, and now will use the popsicle he is offering as a start up to create my own popsicle factory.  When I read this back - I could really use some insight on if this goes against the principle of non-agression or private property.  I can't think of a reason why it does.  This sounds like something Dagny, from Atlas Shrugged, would use to put her in a better business situation.

 

Meanwhile, I better start drawing up my plans for my popsicle factory.