Dealing with online jerks

[Cosmin]

Hi guys,

 

I think we've all been there: talking with people online, explaining to them how government is force, how taxes are theft because you can't not pay them, etc. Some people get it, others don't, and others are just plain jerks about it. They get dismissive, sarcastic or outright insulting.

 

On an intellectual level I know that I should not engage with the abusive people and that their opinions should not affect me, but on an emotional level I get a bit hurt and insecure - "maybe I do talk too much about anarchy, maybe I am annoying". I guess the easiest approach would be to just hang around "safe" places, like the FDR forum, but I would like to spread the truth to new people as well.

 

How do you deal with online jerks? Do they get to you?

[MysterionMuffles]

I remember that these strangers don't mean a thing to me so it's not in my place to debate with them at an emotional level. 

 

I once went into a My Little Pony chatroom and asked if there were taxes in Equestria (the world MLP takes place in) and I sparked a huge debate. It went ugly to say the least and they couldn't understand that taxation was force. Then they tried to mire the debate with free will vs. determinism and "WHAT ABOUT THE ROADS?!" bs until I went from first principles. I tried to explain self ownership and the NAP but by then I think they got exhausted with being proven wrong. They ended up taking a half hour trying to ask me about self ownership and I literally explained it so many ways that I think they were just stumped and wanted to stall for time, until of course I got exhausted and decided to leave.

 

Here's the thing Cosmin: people's online anger has nothing to do with you. It's their own crap to deal with. On Xboxlive I've had a lot of people send me hatemail, even people who have beaten me! And I already know that their rage at my skills or lack thereof has nothing to do with me. They expect me to play or behave a certain way but I don't, and it shakes up their routine or something. Either way, Ive gotten hatemail and a year ago or so, started to psychologize people who do this. 7/10 times I start to see a real human being because I just ask him how their day was. It always turns out that they're really angry at their coworkers, their boss or even friends and family when I take the time to ask them.

 

So how do I deal with online jerks? I become curious. Ask them why they think the way they do. Sometimes I even ask how I can improve my game if I beat someone or if they beat me, and since they expect me to talk shit back to them, but DONT--it totally shakes their shit up and they start to calm down.

 

As for do they get to me? Not so much anymore when I take a breath and remember what I shared with you here.

[Brentb]

Don't talk to people who aren't listening. It's a complete waste of time. 

 

As Rainbow suggested, you can listen to them and ask them questions, but that is usually an extensive and time-consuming process to go through in an online format - it can occur over days or weeks, and the person will forget the reasoning of previous days, rehash old garbage, go off on tangents, and of course others will jump in for further obfuscation. It's a great suggestion for in-person conversations, but online I personally have failed more often than I've succeeded in getting people to question their own thinking in a significant way. Maybe you'll be great at it, but I can't herd those kittens.

 

The only time that communication occurs is when questions are being answered. Otherwise you're just making noise.

 

If you're making statements that are not an answer to a question in the other person's mind, then you're not communicating. Similarly, if you're asking questions that you don't genuinely have in order to direct the conversation, then you're not communicating.

[MysterionMuffles]

Yeah it's harder on a message board. It has to be as real time as it gets like instant messaging voice or text.

 

Otherwise it's pointless. Who are these people to you? Why does it matter that they adapt to your views? You're better off trying that with people in your immediate world.

[RyanT]

On an intellectual level I know that I should not engage with the abusive people and that their opinions should not affect me, but on an emotional level I get a bit hurt and insecure - "maybe I do talk too much about anarchy, maybe I am annoying". I guess the easiest approach would be to just hang around "safe" places, like the FDR forum, but I would like to spread the truth to new people as well.

 

Know that feeling...all too well.  

 

I reckon this really ties in well with Rainbow Jamz's thread last week "Too Preachy" 

 

Certainly I'll repeat what I said there, 

 

People have all these buzzword/magic spells, to avoid examining morality

usually by projecting the negative back onto you and provoking self attack, 

making you feel like a 'bore', 'geek', 'freak', 'insensitive' whatever.

 

Always worth remembering that when faced with these facts and arguments

most people feel really shitty and their brains will totally work overtime to come

up with a 'counter attack'.

 

I remember a caller had once questioned the existence of god to his girlfriend, 

and she'd come back with something along the lines of, 

'Well I guess I've just more love in my heart than you'.

 

I can't recall the exact quotation but Stefan was like 'wow, you could spend weeks

coming up with an attack that sophisticated', and she'd just spat it out on the fly.

...and that's what we're up against.

 

So I do think we have to be quite careful, and honest about where we are emotionally, 

before actually engaging with people in these situations.

 

Of course we feel the need to go out and spread the message,

but to be effective, we have to do it (and ourselves) justice.

 

While surrounding yourself with people who already have a decent grasp of virtue and morality, 

might seem like the 'easy option' if not a downright 'cop out',

 

you wouldn't be expected to get into the boxing ring for a serious fight without a lot of training?

and punching a guy in the face has to be a lot easier than what we're trying to do?

[dsayers]

If somebody voices a complaint, even if it's in the form of an attack, I at least consider it. If there's validity in their gripe, I won't let their flawed delivery prevent me from improving myself. If it turns out to be hokum, I toss it aside.

 

That's after the fact. In the moment, I'll usually just point out that ad hominem isn't an argument (mostly for the benefit of others) and walk away. Like Brent said, there's no point in talking to somebody who isn't listening. Or, perhaps more importantly, there's no point in talking to somebody who isn't interested in the truth despite pretending to be engaging in a curiosity-based conversation (two-way).

[SovereignMan]

I have found it best to just stick to the facts, and don't let them sway you into an emotional debate. If they can only offer emotionally charged statements or insults, then they have no base. Call them on their bullshit, and ask them direct questions. The only reason they would use a tactic like that, is so they can avoid actually debating facts. Sephan's video "Feminist Straw Woman Attacks!" is a good example of this.