Jot Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Your take on this:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUs6pAmaumM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest eudaimon Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Nonsense for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brentb Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 1) hierarchy is a system or organization in which people or groups are ranked one above the other according to status or authority 2) Increased status and authority in a free market environment are primarily a consequence of the value that one provides to others. 3) Therefore, people who oppose hierarchy must also fundamentally oppose providing value. 4) Telling the truth is providing value. 5) People who oppose hierarchy oppose telling the truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jot Posted June 12, 2014 Author Share Posted June 12, 2014 1) hierarchy is a system or organization in which people or groups are ranked one above the other according to status or authority 2) Increased status and authority in a free market environment are primarily a consequence of the value that one provides to others. 3) Therefore, people who oppose hierarchy must also fundamentally oppose providing value. 4) Telling the truth is providing value. 5) People who oppose hierarchy oppose telling the truth The point where they diverge is that Stefan thinks that in a free market society people won't be interested in recreating the state and even if they did they couldn't accomplish it for reasons Stef talked many times before whereas Peter thinks the opposite...I just struggle with this particular point, I cannot figure out how to figure out who would be right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpus mentium Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Have you seen this thread? https://board.freedomainradio.com/topic/37268-peter-joseph-is-not-happy-with-stef/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan C. Posted June 12, 2014 Share Posted June 12, 2014 Increased status and authority in a free market environment are primarily a consequence of the value that one provides to others. Precisely. Ludwig von Mises said something similar in The Anti-Capitalistic Mentality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jot Posted June 12, 2014 Author Share Posted June 12, 2014 Have you seen this thread? https://board.freedomainradio.com/topic/37268-peter-joseph-is-not-happy-with-stef/ No...thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philschneider Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 In my opinion then main argument and frustration between these two men is the fact that Stephan refused to look at the zeitgeist movement in theoretical sense as Peter does. Just like if you look at communism in a theoretical sense it seems crazy to not agree with it. It sound like a utopia. the zeitgeist movement is the same. In theory the zeitgeist movement could actually happen and end up perfectly like Peter wishes, but it could also end up being a world wide genocide far worse then communism. Anarchy is partially theoretical as well, but it has piles of real life examples and is practical. Stephan refused to engage in a practical organization of the world by using theoretical ideas and would not back down to Peter's wishful thinking. This caused Peter to become enraged and feel like Stephan was cornering him. Peter seems to think his idea is better because it is a perfect world where everyone is happy where anarchy can theoretically be perfect, but will practically never be a utopia. Peter is stuck in this mind set where he thinks that the world can be a Utopia and anything less is a failure in comparison. If Stephan would have considered Peter's theory at all practical and Peter considered that Utopia is practically impossible then they could have met in the middle, or at least been less angry. I think as long as Peter thinks that everyone can be equal and live in a Utopia there is no arguing with him. It is sad though because they both are interested in the same thing. They have the same enemy, yet they are enemies with each other. And in an anarchist world it is perfectly feasible for Peter to try his zeitgeist movement small scale and voluntarily before trying to make it a world phenomenon. I would think Peter would support anarchy as a way to move towards his end goals. On a side note from the video above Peter Called Stephen a lier. I found this ironic seeing that most of Zeitgeist 1 was completely fabricated or based off terrible sources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts