creakins Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 Hi, A friend of mine was on a conference over the weekend. During this conference he ended up sleeping with a woman. A month ago he bought a house and moved in with his girlfriend though, and he has found himself in this predicament. He has confessed this to me, and probably will not confess this to anyone else. When I told him that I felt that being honest was going to be the key to his happiness, he said that the fact that he cheated means that he just has to work harder in the relationship. Yet being honest about his actions doesn't fall under the category of working harder. In fact, he's going to work harder at being more dishonest. I made this clear to him, and he has decided that telling his girlfriend about his actions is going to ruin everything that he has worked so hard to build with her over the past few years and will find him, more than likely, without his girlfriend and no longer owning the home he shares. To add gas to this fire, the girl that he is with is a keeper. Not a bone of crazy. Raised right. Works really hard, has a great job and career, and loves my friend to death. I really care for this young lady. I don't know what to say to my friend, or what advice to give him. I really want to give him the right advice, honest advice. I have told him that he needs to tell his girlfriend because hiding this act is only going to build a relationship on lies from this point forward. What advice would you give to a friend in this situation? At what cost? C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wuzzums Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 I don't think you have any sort of obligation in all of this, and it's my impression your friend might be trying to give you one. He came to you with what he did, he made it perfectly clear he's not gonna tell his concubine, and he basically warned you he'll suffer a great deal if word ever comes out. He wanted the relief of coming clean to someone, and he's trying to recruit you in his dishonesty. If you did go along with it, what happens if he does it again? What happens if it's discovered? Second time around you'll look complicit in the whole affair, that's because you will be. You purposely kept valuable information hidden and condoned such behavior because, I assume, you still want to be friends with him. Like I said, you have no obligation and he's forcing one on you by giving you sensible information. If it was me I would make it perfectly clear to him that I do not abide his behavior and what he said to me in confidence will not remain as such. I will say that I will not go around telling everybody about his one night stand, but I will tell anyone that asks me directly about it, especially if it's the woman he's tricking. Furthermore, because I value honesty I cannot be associated with dishonest people. Again, the last bit would just be my reaction in this situation. Personally I would cut a friendship like that off in a second. If he's able to do that to the person he's most invested in, where do I stand in his hierarchy by being just some friend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prolix Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 creakins, on a scale of 1-10 how interested are you in a relationship are you with with your friends keeper girlfriend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Futurama Philosopher Posted June 24, 2014 Share Posted June 24, 2014 According my understanding of UPB and Real Time Relationships, he already doesn't have a relationship, All he has is his own act of betrayal and the person he's now manipulating. aka his victim. If he wanted any chance of not living with a fantasy, he would have to confess and let the chips fall where they may. The next ethical questions are.... How long or how far would you let this girl be exposed to her own victimization? If you don't say anything, are you an accomplice in the betrayal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattGrimes Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Well first I would like to say Hello and thanks for coming to the board with this question. I will of course put the caveat that everything below is just my opinions and my interpretations, so all I ask is that you consider them and of course discard them if they are in no way valid. Also for whatever it is worth, I cheated on a girlfriend 7 years ago, and I tried to hide it from her for a few months until she found out. We broke up for a few months but ended up getting back together and spent the next four years together. Long story short, it was a disaster of a relationship, full of co-depedent and self-destructive tendencies. We broke up 3 years ago and I am still recovering from the damage that that relationship did to my life, and if she had a chance to get her life put back together from her broken childhood, that relationship definitely made the potential light at the end of the tunnel a whole lot dimmer. I have forgiven myself for the harm I have caused, as I too was a broken child and have put enormous effort into becoming a better person since then--the ending of that relationship being what truly spurred me to seek truth and wisdom--however the damage I had caused in her life tortured me for a long time. But I digress, onto your question: A friend of mine was on a conference over the weekend. During this conference he ended up sleeping with a woman. Well, right off the bat, No. He did not 'end up sleeping with a women' like it was some thing that just 'happened to him'. He consciously chose to betray his girlfriend in the most absolute form possible. . A month ago he bought a house and moved in with his girlfriend though, and he has found himself in this predicament. Again, weasley language. He did not 'find himself' in this predicament, it was not 'dropped on him'. He took everything he knew and valued about this woman and this relationship and what it means to him and the feelings of this woman, and he said fuck it and have sex with some other women. Where this language is coming from I cannot claim any knowledge however I think it's worth considering the following possibilites: 1. you may be attempting to downplay so as to 'protect' your friend (ie protect him from truth and facilitate his lies) 2. You wish to downplay the reality so as to 'feel better' if you do not intervene (if it would otherwise tug on your conscience) 3. It may be his language and you are unknowingly repeating his mythology, possibly indictating that you have a history of being forced to repeat the mythologies of others so as to avoid attack for yourself. Or none of these could be the case, however I just want to provide as much though provoking feedback as possible on the chance that they may resonate with your situation. He has confessed this to me, and probably will not confess this to anyone else. When I told him that I felt that being honest was going to be the key to his happiness, he said that the fact that he cheated means that he just has to work harder in the relationship. Yet being honest about his actions doesn't fall under the category of working harder. In fact, he's going to work harder at being more dishonest. I support your statement of the significance of honesty, though I get the impression you are quite fearful of your friend. Of course, again take this for whatever it's worth, and it could entirely be just a mis-interpretation due to the medium that is text or my own faults, however I get the impression that 1. you are not confident in your own belief that honesty is the key to happiness and/or 2. you do not feel comfortable asserting your true values and beliefs and sticking to them with this 'friend'. If the former is the case, it may be worth considering what you value and how important it is to you (and whether you want people with opposite values in your life) and/or if this fear of honesty is pervasive in your life and why that may be, and if it is the latter, similarly, I would question whether a true friend would make you fearful to be honest with them. Second, the statement that he 'just has to work harder' is, I think we both agree, absurd and clearly not a 'working harder' to be honest or open. Honestly, I don't even know what he means by 'work harder'; the only thing I could think he would mean would be "I'll buy her more shit" or "treat her 'like a princess' to her falce (while I lie behind her back)" or something similar. I made this clear to him, and he has decided that telling his girlfriend about his actions is going to ruin everything that he has worked so hard to build with her over the past few years and will find him, more than likely, without his girlfriend and no longer owning the home he shares. He should have thought of that before he cheated. Actions have consequences, and dragging 'friends' to cover up one's lies is a pretty dispicable act by any standard. To add gas to this fire, the girl that he is with is a keeper. Not a bone of crazy. Raised right. Works really hard, has a great job and career, and loves my friend to death. I really care for this young lady. I don't know what to say to my friend, or what advice to give him. I really want to give him the right advice, honest advice. I have told him that he needs to tell his girlfriend because hiding this act is only going to build a relationship on lies from this point forward. What advice would you give to a friend in this situation? At what cost? Well first, I would argue that any woman who would date, or claim to love, the kind of man who would cheat on her--The signs of low self-esteem, the signs of inconsistent behavior, the signs of a deficiency of the ability to acount for long term consequences, etc. would all be there long before he actually cheated on her--would suggest the strong possibility that this girl, though wonderful she may be, has a lot she has yet to discover about herself or her 'blindspots'. Again, of course, that's not to say for aboslute certain, though I would argue it deserves a lot of thought. Also that doesn't mean she's 'crazy' or anything, just that she likely has a long way to go with self knowledge. To answer your question, I, and no one, can decide what you should do, however I would like to put forward some things to think about. For one, If I were in this situation, I would not stand for it. Sidenote: I wanted to say 'unfortunately you got dragged into a situation that shouldn't be your problem', then I thought "well by being friends with this guy, you are accepting any negative situations that such a 'friendship' may present", but then I thought "Well, of course, it is ultimately the fault of your parents that they did not model integrity and honesty to the degree that you were not turned off by this guy and never would have been friends with him the first place", though the degree to which any of those is valid is convoluted and complex; just something to consider. Anyway, I don't know how old this couple is, but this could be the rest of this girls life. What if your 'friend' got a sexually transmitted disease? What if your friend got this other woman pregnant? What if--and I'd argue, more of 'what about when'--he cheats on her again? What happens if they get married; either she's going to find out eventually or his guilt is going to overwhelm the marriage. What does that mean for the children? More kids growing up with out dads? More fighting and divorce? What happens if the other woman tries to get money from your friend for her child? What happens if your friend transmits the disease to this girl? The degree to which this can destroy multiple lives is staggering and should be heavily considered. Your friend made his choice, but this woman is at least mostly innocent in the situation, and their children will be entirely innocent. Do you really value this guys 'friendship' so much that you would be willing to be complicit in the possible destruction of this woman and their children's lives? If you truly care about your friend, the girl, or their children, would you not want the consequences to be swift and potentitally life saving? Finding this out about her boyfriend could get her to stop and think about the kind of men she is dating, and cause her to get therapy which will exponentially increase her happiness. Not enabling your friends reckless behavior and lies could cause him to reconsider the direction of his life and do the same. And regardless of how their relationship turns out or the directions they choose, being truly honest and courageous and living your values could change your life for the better as well. I understand is very scary, and possibly terrifying if you have been attacked throughout your life for the virtures of honesty and integrity--something I strongly empathize with--, but for what is at stake, I strongly recommend you consider the ramifications for all parties involved for either choice. This situation is not your responsibility, however you do have in your hands the power to better many lives--or at least not facilitate corruption--including your own via honesty. Well that's all I really had. I hope this post will be of use and help you make whatever decision you choose to make, and i look forward to your feedback. 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RyanT Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 Think Wuzzums nailed it, He betrayed his girlfriend, now it seems he wants to normalizing that by putting you in a position whereby you can either be complicit in his betrayal or else 'betray' his confidence by telling her, thereby putting the 'responsibility' on you for them breaking up and losing the house..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatrickC Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 He betrayed his girlfriend, now it seems he wants to normalizing that by putting you in a position whereby you can either be complicit in his betrayal or else 'betray' his confidence by telling her, thereby putting the 'responsibility' on you for them breaking up and losing the house..... If you desire virtue for yourself, then the only virtuous thing you can do is point out the positions as Ryan mentions above that this friend has put you in. This is piss poor behaviour on their part and I would expect to be called on it, if I ever attempted the same with any friend of mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjt Posted June 25, 2014 Share Posted June 25, 2014 What if your 'friend' got a sexually transmitted disease? What if your friend got this other woman pregnant? What if--and I'd argue, more of 'what about when'--he cheats on her again? What happens if they get married; either she's going to find out eventually or his guilt is going to overwhelm the marriage. What does that mean for the children? More kids growing up with out dads? More fighting and divorce? What happens if the other woman tries to get money from your friend for her child? What happens if your friend transmits the disease to this girl? The degree to which this can destroy multiple lives is staggering and should be heavily considered. Your friend made his choice, but this woman is at least mostly innocent in the situation, and their children will be entirely innocent. Do you really value this guys 'friendship' so much that you would be willing to be complicit in the possible destruction of this woman and their children's lives? If you truly care about your friend, the girl, or their children, would you not want the consequences to be swift and potentitally life saving? Finding this out about her boyfriend could get her to stop and think about the kind of men she is dating, and cause her to get therapy which will exponentially increase her happiness. Not enabling your friends reckless behavior and lies could cause him to reconsider the direction of his life and do the same. Sorry about all this. I was just reading through MattGrimes response and it really hit me... look at this enormous burden your friend has placed on you. Even though your friend did not cheat on you, I believe you have every right to be very angry with his actions leading up to this point. I don't know what you should do (getting angry is a start), but the others in this thread have offered very rational advice that I think is very much worth studying and stewing on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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