Paul Elam on the Woman Against Feminism.

[Bortasz]

I think this should be spread. 

 

 

And this is page of Woman Against Feminism and they Facebook site: http://womenagainstfeminism.tumblr.com/https://www.facebook.com/WomenAgainstFeminism/likes

[LovePrevails]

I enjoyed

[J. D. Stembal]

I love the fact that men now have a unified voice, and it is becoming louder. I just wish some of these guys closely associated with Elam would openly reject child abuse as Molyneux does, but they are too busy pointing out how crazy feminism is and how foolish they now look in the media and using this as a metric to validate their own progress striving for men's rights. They are too involved with patting themselves on the back for not being crazy. We should be validating our progress as MRAs by how many children we are saving from institutionalized abuse. Yes, I do believe that feminists support child abuse, through supporting public school indoctrination and irresponsible daycare practices. That's how the feminists will have another generation of brainwashed men and women joining their ranks.

[Bortasz]

I love the fact that men now have a unified voice, and it is becoming louder. I just wish some of these guys closely associated with Elam would openly reject child abuse as Molyneux does, but they are too busy pointing out how crazy feminism is and how foolish they now look in the media and using this as a metric to validate their own progress striving for men's rights. They are too involved with patting themselves on the back for not being crazy. We should be validating our progress as MRAs by how many children we are saving from institutionalized abuse. Yes, I do believe that feminists support child abuse, through supporting public school indoctrination and irresponsible daycare practices. That's how the feminists will have another generation of brainwashed men and women joining their ranks.

Stefen fights on children front. They fights on the Father front.The most important think that save kids to become criminales are good father in the home.So I think that they fight for good cause.

[Mr. Wrong]

The synergy of the free market will eventually spark a peaceful parenting arm on the Men's Movement. Hell, the Men's Movement sparked an anti-feminist, Men's Rights arm in the Freedomain community, right? All we have to do is keep at it. The Men's Movement would very much like to claim their's is a better parenting methodology and also add weight to their claims of single-motherhood being worse for children and, of course, child abuse is going to be a key factor addressed.

 

Erin Pizzey has also brought up the concept of the cycle of violence so it's not like there aren't huge voices in the Men's Movement not already informed.

[Frosty]

I love the fact that men now have a unified voice, and it is becoming louder. I just wish some of these guys closely associated with Elam would openly reject child abuse as Molyneux does, but they are too busy pointing out how crazy feminism is and how foolish they now look in the media and using this as a metric to validate their own progress striving for men's rights. They are too involved with patting themselves on the back for not being crazy. We should be validating our progress as MRAs by how many children we are saving from institutionalized abuse. Yes, I do believe that feminists support child abuse, through supporting public school indoctrination and irresponsible daycare practices. That's how the feminists will have another generation of brainwashed men and women joining their ranks.

 

Some MRAs are libertarian and support the NAP such as myself.

 

One of the big issues facing men is that they have the state telling them that they cannot be near their children, that they're a danger to their children and have to pay for everything but have minimal to no contact. Men cannot possibly spread the word of peaceful parenting and hope to raise their children well if they first cannot even get access to their own children.

 

There's many good things that people can fight for and people ought to fight for everything they think is right, but just like Stefan doesn't deal with anything that's not really philosophy related, the MRM don't really deal with anything outside of men's rights, i think it's fair to be focused like that, many people such as myself support both positions and follow Paul and Stefan equally, there is some cross over and I think it's great to get both communities involved with each other, and where I can I do recommend members of the groups to each other.

[J. D. Stembal]

Sure, sure. Not All MRAs Are Like That.

 

I was leveling my criticism at Elam and the folks he likes to have on his shows. It's not that I don't support Elam and his cohort. I love their enthusiasm and confidence regarding men's rights issues, but I've listened to a little of Elam's material, and he's more focused on getting in feminist's faces and making waves. He acts like a lightning rod for the venomous cries of misogyny coming from radical feminism. While this illustrates that there is a vocal group of advocates of both genders for men's rights, it does nothing to actually solve the issues in the long run. Misandry starts in the home - and is perpetuated in the school system - when boys are held to a different standard than girls. My half brother is in elementary school currently and he understands that girls are universally treated better than boys, mainly because most of the teachers are career feminist bigots. He doesn't understand the reasons because they do not make sense, of course. When he hears arguments leveled at feminists as an adult, he will attack the advocates for men's rights because he will have normalized this socially approved sexism. I wager that we all have normalized this double standard of the sexes in our childhoods. I know I have.

 

Not even a year ago, I was hanging out with a group of male friends with no women present. The topic shifted to spanking and nearly every single one of us echoed the sentiment that one of the things wrong with parenting today is that they aren't hitting their kids enough. Clearly, we all had normalized the abuse because we were actively supporting it through our own faulty philosophy. At least one of the five men in this discussion was a veteran of the military.

 

My fear is that many of the more vocal supporters of men's rights will not be opposed to child abuse because it will been seen as a badge of honor for young men. MRAs are quick to point out that women weren't ever subjected to conscription into the military, but that doesn't mean that they will recognize physical and emotional abuse as the necessary hallmark of grooming a child into volunteering for military service. Stefan Molyneux points this out in his criticisms of the single mother and feminism. I can't recall if MRAs like Karen Straughan have also acknowledged this systematic abuse of boys and its relevance to the military and state of perpetual war in which we are involved around the globe currently. If other MRAs, like Paul Elam, vocally reject child abuse and militarism, then consider my criticism unfounded.

[hannahbanana]

 

 If other MRAs, like Paul Elam, vocally reject child abuse and militarism, then consider my criticism unfounded.

Aren't most MRAs strongly opposed to circumcision? That is a form of child abuse, and even if it may be a bit selective as to which aspects child abuse they oppose, it is still drawing attention to how young children are treated based on their gender.

[PatrickC]

Stefen fights on children front. They fights on the Father front.The most important think that save kids to become criminales are good father in the home.So I think that they fight for good cause.

 

Thanks for sharing this video Bortasz. Most enjoyable.

 

I broadly agree with your comment above. There is a useful symbiotic relationship between FDR and the AVfM or the MRM more broadly, that will facilitate the support and safe future of children. But more importantly many men in the MRM will now probably never have children with crazy ladies, therefore acerbating the future abuse of defenseless children.

 

One thing I like about the MRM and MGTOW community is the opportunity to bond and empathise with men. Which is a new and exciting future for greater and more productive relationships amongst men that have been lost over the decades.

[Bortasz]

Thanks for sharing this video Bortasz. Most enjoyable.

 

I broadly agree with your comment above. There is a useful symbiotic relationship between FDR and the AVfM or the MRM more broadly, that will facilitate the support and safe future of children. But more importantly many men in the MRM will now probably never have children with crazy ladies, therefore acerbating the future abuse of defenseless children.

 

One thing I like about the MRM and MGTOW community is the opportunity to bond and empathise with men. Which is a new and exciting future for greater and more productive relationships amongst men that have been lost over the decades.

This is my point of sharing this Video. 

I don't understand endtheusurpation hate (Because for me it is a hate) for Paul. 

The Feminist are natural enemy of all thinking beings on this Planet. They are responsible for laws that:

- Separate fathers from children

- Increase numbers of single mothers

- Practically legalize a scam business where young woman use babes as a weapon against man. 

How anybody with functional brain not be oppose to that? 

 

 

 

My fear is that many of the more vocal supporters of men's rights will not be opposed to child abuse because it will been seen as a badge of honor for young men. MRAs are quick to point out that women weren't ever subjected to conscription into the military, but that doesn't mean that they will recognize physical and emotional abuse as the necessary hallmark of grooming a child into volunteering for military service. Stefan Molyneux points this out in his criticisms of the single mother and feminism. I can't recall if MRAs like Karen Straughan have also acknowledged this systematic abuse of boys and its relevance to the military and state of perpetual war in which we are involved around the globe currently. If other MRAs, like Paul Elam, vocally reject child abuse and militarism, then consider my criticism unfounded.

How you can claim that separating a father from children is not a child abuse? And sorry WTF with that all Badge of honor? You really thinking that young fathers will brag how they beat up they children? That they will create competition how punch a babe without making a mark? 

I have problems with understanding you. For THOUSANDS of years the evolution genetically program men to protect women and children. Even the smell of women tears lower the testosterone levels of men: http://healthland.time.com/2011/01/06/the-crying-game-womens-tears-dial-down-testosterone/ And yet the entire legal system and society treats man like pedophiles that just not being caught yet. 

How the F separating the natural protector of children, there natural father is not a child abuse? Stefan want's children to stop being abuse, then he and everybody who support him MUST support Men's rights movement. Sorry but this is simple fact. For love of reason look add this:

 

 

Consider these facts:

• 85% of all children that exhibit behavioral disorders come from fatherless homes (U.S. Center for Disease Control);
• 90% of all homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes (U.S. Bureau of the Census);
• 80% of rapists motivated with displaced anger come from fatherless homes (Criminal Justice & Behavior, Vol 14, p. 403-26, 1978);
• 70% of juveniles in state-operated institutions come from fatherless homes (U.S. Dept. of Justice, Special Report, Sept 1988);
• 85% of all youths sitting in prisons grew up in a fatherless home (Texas Dept. of Corrections 1992).

In fact, you can pick a social ill at random and you will find that the correlation with fatherless is clear and direct. Depression. Suicide. Dropping out of school. Teenage pregnancy. Drug use. In sum, fatherless children are:

• 5 times more likely to commit suicide;
• 32 times more likely to run away;
• 20 times more likely to have behavioral disorders;
• 14 times more likely to commit rape;
• 9 times more likely to drop out of high school;
• 10 times more likely to abuse chemical substances;
• 9 times more likely to end up in a mental institution;
• 20 times more likely to end up in prison(1).

http://mkg4583.wordpress.com/2010/08/01/fatherlessness-the-root-causes-of-crime/

This take a minute to research what ABSENT of a FATHER in home can cause to a child. How Thinking emphatic people that can see this can object to anybody who want to end all of that? How fighting for a law that support fathers rights can be seen as something else like fight for end of child abuse? Can somebody pleas explain this to me? 

[J. D. Stembal]

Aren't most MRAs strongly opposed to circumcision? That is a form of child abuse, and even if it may be a bit selective as to which aspects child abuse they oppose, it is still drawing attention to how young children are treated based on their gender.

 

Thanks for pointing that out. While you are correct, I don't think I've heard anyone but Karen Straughan and Stefan Molyneux talking about circumcision. Paul Elam talks a lot about social programming and learned gender roles, but he doesn't underscore the systematic abuse of children of both sexes. Circumcision directly affects the enjoyment of sexual intercourse. It would be a stretch to draw a connection between a surgical procedure done shortly after birth and militarism. I suppose you could sort through a DoD database to see if a high proportion of soldiers are circumcised, but no one has demonstrated a parallel yet.

 

(Ok, I found a link where Elam discusses circumcision as genital mutilation.

 

)

 

Elam does point out that often the victims of domestic abuse are the ones who get arrested - men, but he doesn't oppose corporal punishment (spanking) of children and expose it for the loosely veiled sexual abuse that it is.

 

Thanks for the information, Bortasz. I did not wish to imply that fatherless children are not at risk. I have suffered from depression, thoughts of suicide, and drug abuse and I've had a father my whole life. I did not see much of him or my mother when I was very young, and I was punished with spanking up to about the age of nine. I like how Molyneux frames discussions using the family as a lens because it make everyone look at the issues using their own experiences.

 

I still don't understand why discussions of spanking are basically non-existent in the men's rights groups.

[Bortasz]

Thanks for pointing that out. While you are correct, I don't think I've heard anyone but Karen Straughan and Stefan Molyneux talking about circumcision. Paul Elam talks a lot about social programming and learned gender roles, but he doesn't underscore the systematic abuse of children of both sexes. Circumcision directly affects the enjoyment of sexual intercourse. It would be a stretch to draw a connection between a surgical procedure done shortly after birth and militarism. I suppose you could sort through a DoD database to see if a high proportion of soldiers are circumcised, but no one has demonstrated a parallel yet.

 

(Ok, I found a link where Elam discusses circumcision as genital mutilation.

 

)

 

Elam does point out that often the victims of domestic abuse are the ones who get arrested - men, but he doesn't oppose corporal punishment (spanking) of children and expose it for the loosely veiled sexual abuse that it is.

 

Thanks for the information, Bortasz. I did not wish to imply that fatherless children are not at risk. I have suffered from depression, thoughts of suicide, and drug abuse and I've had a father my whole life. I did not see much of him or my mother when I was very young, and I was punished with spanking up to about the age of nine. I like how Molyneux frames discussions using the family as a lens because it make everyone look at the issues using their own experiences.

 

I still don't understand why discussions of spanking are basically non-existent in the men's rights groups.

 

This is just my opinion-vision-understanding of MRM. 

Men's rights movement is focused on Men's = Fathers law's-right's. They will oppose children circumcision. But there first goal is stopping the oppression and persecution of man.. 

This will not help all children's, but if only half.. 40% of rapist gone. 42,5% less children with behavior disorder. 45% of homeless children gone.. less children committing suicide. Less children that become a criminals, less children that become a drug addict. Less prostitution, less bullies. Bringing Fathers, caring Fathers to life of children. Cutting crazy bitches from cash they suck via straw-children from man. This will help. Not all, but many will be safe from abuse, mutilation, life of fear, and doubt. Not all fathers are perfect. Not all are even good. God I know something about this. But just looking on the statistic show how much children will have chance for safe home, by not allowing woman to cut off children from there fathers. They will try protect there children. Saying that you don't like them because they do not oppose spanking.

For me it is like don't liking fire fighters because they want extinguish wild fire that threaten the entire city, and will not stop to safe one lonely house. 

I do not support spanking. I support FDR in there goal to stop child abuse. And I support MRM because for me equalizing the laws, bringing fathers to children life, is the first and maybe biggest step to do this. 

For me MRM fights for presence of fathers in children life. 

Stefan fights for quality of parents. But even the perfect, the best of all fathers, will change nothing if he will be absent in the life of children. 

 

PS. And I hope that I do not come of as aggressive. Or rather to much aggressive. Sometimes.. well we all have some demons in our heads. And when I'm passionate about some thing. I can be confrontational.

[J. D. Stembal]

I admire your passion so do not worry about coming across as aggressive. Men's rights is a topic we cannot afford to dismiss casually. I also admire what Elam is doing. I am not trying to argue that Elam & Co. are not to be taken seriously because they don't specifically address spanking, and other forms of emotional and sexual abuse. Clearly, I do not assume that Elam supports abuse in any way. I am openly questioning why many in the internet community are not as anti-spanking as Molyneux. I am concerned that some MRAs are missing the whole picture.

 

I agree that we should be fighting for the rights of fathers, but we should also be critical of the roles of both parents are playing in the home with regard to raising children.

[Bortasz]

I admire your passion so do not worry about coming across as aggressive. Men's rights is a topic we cannot afford to dismiss casually. I also admire what Elam is doing. I am not trying to argue that Elam & Co. are not to be taken seriously because they don't specifically address spanking, and other forms of emotional and sexual abuse. Clearly, I do not assume that Elam supports abuse in any way. I am openly questioning why many in the internet community are not as anti-spanking as Molyneux. I am concerned that some MRAs are missing the whole picture.

 

I agree that we should be fighting for the rights of fathers, but we should also be critical of the roles of both parents are playing in the home with regard to raising children.

Of course some MRM miss the picture. Or more precisely have different opinion. Some are religious some are atheist. They have different background so they can look on the picture and see different things. I'm pretty certain that you will find in MRM guy who is against circumcision but will not see a problem in spanking. The MRM cause can be seen as a big one. And will gather people of different opinions. It is like a building a dam to power up nearby city. Everybody can see it.Stefan cause... it is small rock that can cause earth quake. People have tendency to focus on thinks they see as big. Also they must first notice a problem. What laws against men do to our society are more visible than spanking of children. Spanking was and is. So people do not see it as a problem. When some time ago the laws such as custody of children where completely different so people see them.

It take education and time to enlightening people.