transient Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 So, I was talking to my someone today and I said something about checking the evidence and drawing a logical conclusion from there. They responded with: "I hate when people say 'evidence', I don't know what evidence is real. Is space real? You don't know, you haven't been there..." There was a bit more to it than that, but I can't remember all. Anyway, what I want to ask is how should I have reacted, or how would you have? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsayers Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 It's good to be skeptical. It's good to keep in mind that sometimes what's offered as evidence is made up. As long as it doesn't prevent somebody from accepting the value of evidence and agreeing that it's important all the same. I also think it's good that they're aware that they have that bias and that they're willing to share it with you. I can't really tell just by the text provided: Was this a hostile protest or a segue into a conversation about evidence? What was the topic of discussion? I find the leap to space as an example to be a curious one. Were you guys talking about something commonly intangible such as space? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transient Posted December 20, 2014 Author Share Posted December 20, 2014 Thanks for the reply. I agree that being skeptical of things can be good. When searching information I tend to check multiple sources so that I'm not taking a single persons word for it. But,I think this person was saying, they didn't want to take a scientists word so instead they should take someone else's. The conversation revolved mainly about religion and parenting. Nothing to do with space. The above quote from the original post occurred when we were talking about theory of evolution. They took a creationist stance on the subject. I left this out originaly because I didn't want to make this thread about religion. It never really got hostile exactly. But they did seem defensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepin Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 One particular question to ask is "what is real?". Try to figure out what they mean, and just be a five year old. Most people put forward ideas like they make sense and are evident, and simply questioning what does not make sense to you is a way around it. It does not mean to disagree, as you can't disagree with a claim you don't understand, but just to figure out what they mean. You may find that they have a great idea and were not able to articulate it, or more likely, that they don't even understand what they are saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsayers Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 The above quote from the original post occurred when we were talking about theory of evolution. They took a creationist stance on the subject. I left this out originaly because I didn't want to make this thread about religion. Why not? He clearly has. When somebody says to you, "I believe what I believe because I want to believe it," then the claim that evidence may not be reliable isn't a mark of skepticism, but of bias confirmation. It also reveals that "real" isn't actually a standard he lives by, just one he's willing to cart out when it suits his bias. You can't have a mathematical discussion with somebody who, on a whim, will suddenly shift into a world where 2+2=5 is valid. Just as you wouldn't be able to have a conversation in English with somebody who doesn't speak English; It's just two people who communicate in incompatible fashions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-William Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 Anyway, what I want to ask is how should I have reacted, or how would you have? Was this a girl you were talking to? I can't imagine why anyone would care what she "hated" in a philosophical discussion unless this was a girl. And while I'm on the guessing train, I will guess that she is pretty because otherwise your brain would have been working and you could have simply stolen her wallet. If she objected you could reply "evidence is unreliable, this is my wallet" and then simply walked away. It's no accident that Ayn Rand wasn't pretty. I doubt she would have been as good as she was at philosophy if she had said "I hate Plato" and everyone around her had said "oh yes, Plato is a bad man, don't you worry your pretty little head about that". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transient Posted December 22, 2014 Author Share Posted December 22, 2014 One particular question to ask is "what is real?". Try to figure out what they mean, and just be a five year old. Most people put forward ideas like they make sense and are evident, and simply questioning what does not make sense to you is a way around it. It does not mean to disagree, as you can't disagree with a claim you don't understand, but just to figure out what they mean. You may find that they have a great idea and were not able to articulate it, or more likely, that they don't even understand what they are saying. Thanks for this advice. I tried at lunch to ask them what is real. For every answer they gave, I reiterated their answer and followed up with another question. The talk was short and they kinda just walked out on the conversation. But they basically said they base reality on sense perception and past experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transient Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 Why not? He clearly has. When somebody says to you, "I believe what I believe because I want to believe it," then the claim that evidence may not be reliable isn't a mark of skepticism, but of bias confirmation. It also reveals that "real" isn't actually a standard he lives by, just one he's willing to cart out when it suits his bias. You can't have a mathematical discussion with somebody who, on a whim, will suddenly shift into a world where 2+2=5 is valid. Just as you wouldn't be able to have a conversation in English with somebody who doesn't speak English; It's just two people who communicate in incompatible fashions. I didn't see this reply till today. But yea, I figured out it was confirmation bias after more conversation. I've since been trying to get them to see this too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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