Relationship ambivalence - Should I stay or should I go?

[Mothra]

I have been in my current relationship for almost 2 years, living together for 1 year. I also have an 11 year old daughter from a previous relationship. In the beginning, it was exciting and wonderful, as I imagine most new relationships are. Several factors led us to move in together last February.

 

Things were okay at first, there were a few “red flags” that I overlooked because he made up for them in other ways. But now it seems that the negative is outweighing the positive. He has serious motivation problems. In the past I would have labelled it laziness, but after watching the Gerlach video on laziness and procrastination I am more understanding. He does not clean up after himself and generally has to be asked to help out around the house. Even then, he will do things begrudgingly or half-assed, if he gets around to doing them at all. He has a serious video game addiction about which he is in denial about. His threshold for stress is extremely low, and he handles it by escaping into video games or movies. He is reluctant to talk about his feelings.  He had a pretty rough childhood which I think he is just now starting to realize how it has impacted him. However, I feel a strong resistance in him to talking about it or even thinking about it. His libido decreased quite a bit after moving in together, probably as a result of stress. I tend to feel most loved by physical and sexual affection, so this has been difficult. Dealing with all these things makes me feel drained.

 

The good things… he is an ancap atheist. He is generally a rational person. We see the world in a similar way. We talk about science, politics, history, and economics quite a bit. As well as religion, sociology, etc. We don’t have the bullshit small talk conversations that I hate. He hates sports as much as I do. I feel like I can more or less be myself around him. Most people I have to censor myself around because they talk about meaningless crap. He is very cuddly and will hug and kiss on me quite a bit. I very much enjoy the physical affection. 

 

I feel like if he were to address his issues more head on, not only could the laziness and video game addiction be resolved, but we could be closer, more connected. I think he has a desire to address things, but in his own way, which from what I have seen doesn't seem to work. He is very stubborn. He does not like to be told he is doing something wrong. It triggers him to self-attack and he is extremely hard on himself. Once he does this, it only exacerbates the problem and he becomes even more prone to escape responsibilities.

 

He has become quite draining to live with. I have learned to bottle up my feelings and try to accommodate him, which is really hard… and not healthy. It doesn’t even work. I can manage it for maybe a week or two at a time, then something happens which causes me to explode, although not in anger, but in sadness and crying. The accommodation is not only hard emotionally, but physically as well. 

 

Me trying to figure out his moods and work around them, to be understanding, to not expect too much of him… it has all become a full-time job. Some times I feel like I can’t take it anymore. I’ve wanted to break up with him several times and even talked about it with him once.  But then I remember the good things. I don’t want to lose those. I don’t have anyone else in my life that I can talk about real things with and let my guard down around.

 

We have been going to counseling for a couple of months, but it doesn’t seem to be doing much good. Anything slightly negative said to him by me or the therapist seems to trigger anger and self-attack, and then wanting to run away. He has told me that he doesn’t want to go every week any more. It’s too much. I feel like any progress he's going to make is going to take forever.

 

I feel like I am in an impossible situation. I can’t go and I can’t stay. I know that I can’t change him, and I am growing weary of waiting for him to want to change.  I am so tired of being stressed out and upset, but I don’t want to lose him.  Sometimes I think that there might be someone out there who looks at the world like me, but maybe is not so damaged. I think that the longer I stay in this relationship, the less chance I have of finding someone like that. But I am so scared to leave, because I also fear there is no one I’ll relate to, that this is the best I can do. It’s all so confusing. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[Mister Mister]

Sorry to be annoying, but there is a common pattern of people starting threads on these boards with several paragraphs of life history.  Most people are not going to read all that, and it probably isn't necessary to really offer advice or clarity on the subject.  It would be more helpful for people if you open with a particular issue or question, and let the details fill in as they are needed.

[J. D. Stembal]

I feel like I am in an impossible situation. I can’t go and I can’t stay. I know that I can’t change him, and I am growing weary of waiting for him to want to change.  I am so tired of being stressed out and upset, but I don’t want to lose him.  Sometimes I think that there might be someone out there who looks at the world like me, but maybe is not so damaged. I think that the longer I stay in this relationship, the less chance I have of finding someone like that. But I am so scared to leave, because I also fear there is no one I’ll relate to, that this is the best I can do. It’s all so confusing. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

The situation is not impossible. You can do whatever you want to do.

 

I have great sympathy for what you and your boyfriend went through. He is probably suffering from having hypercritical and abusive parents. I did everything the wrong way growing up, including walking, according to my parents. You have to allow him to get angry at his parents for what they did to him. He won't change until he addresses it.

 

He may act his alter egos out on your child. Please keep this in mind, and watch out for it.

[Mothra]

Sorry to be annoying, but there is a common pattern of people starting threads on these boards with several paragraphs of life history.  Most people are not going to read all that, and it probably isn't necessary to really offer advice or clarity on the subject.  It would be more helpful for people if you open with a particular issue or question, and let the details fill in as they are needed.

 

Not annoying. I appreciate the feedback. I kinda of just didn't know where to start. I've had all this floating around in my head. There hasn't really been one particular issue, it's an amalgamation of lots of different stuff and it's hard to pick out a main issue, if there even is one. 

The situation is not impossible. You can do whatever you want to do.

 

I have great sympathy for what you and your boyfriend went through. He is probably suffering from having hypercritical and abusive parents. I did everything the wrong way growing up, including walking, according to my parents. You have to allow him to get angry at his parents for what they did to him. He won't change until he addresses it.

 

He may act his alter egos out on your child. Please keep this in mind, and watch out for it.

 

Thanks. How did you come to get angry at your parents? What (if anything) can I do to support him in this without pushing him? It would definitely not be appropriate to explicitly say "Your parents are assholes, you should be angrier." I try to just be a supportive listener and ask questions and offer my sympathy on the rare occasions he talks about it.

 

What do you mean by acting out alter egos? Like going into his parental roles and being critical of her? I haven't seen any of that so far.

[MMX2010]

What (if anything) can I do to support him in this without pushing him?

 

Rollo's article here nails it.

 

http://therationalmale.com/2015/04/07/admiration-respect/

 

Please read the entire article: it's worth it. 

 

 

 

 

Compliments are considered an expression of admiration for men, but largely supplication for women. In the past I’ve gone into detail about how compliments for women need to be sparse because, for the greater part of women, compliments have very little value to them. In an age of social media and ‘quick-hit ego boosts’ from her girlfriends and symps, compliments are common.

What’s scarce is valuable, so the rare compliment from a high-value Alpha is a solid reinforcer for a woman – from a Beta compliments are a liability; they are an overt expression of interest from a man she has very little interest in beyond his utility to her.

 

For that same reason, women giving compliments to men they have no genuine admiration for also becomes a liability – even if that liability is just implied to herself. Ergo, women rarely express admiration for a man they genuinely have no true admiration of – it’s too risky. This is why women must be taught (as in Girl With A Dragonfly Tattoo’s post) to be conscious of, and attentive to, delivering compliments to men they’ve committed to, but regard as Beta. Left to their natural impulses women simply avoid complimenting men they have no desire to be held accountable to.

[J. D. Stembal]

Thanks. How did you come to get angry at your parents? What (if anything) can I do to support him in this without pushing him? It would definitely not be appropriate to explicitly say "Your parents are assholes, you should be angrier." I try to just be a supportive listener and ask questions and offer my sympathy on the rare occasions he talks about it.

 

What do you mean by acting out alter egos? Like going into his parental roles and being critical of her? I haven't seen any of that so far.

 

I realized that I had been very angry with my parents my whole life, but I internalized this anger onto myself. Specifically, I was on track to drink myself to death. Quitting drinking (after listening to Asshole Proximity Disorder) certainly helped me gain clarity. It also sent my friends packing, one by one. For him to stop self-attacking, he will have to first question his parents' involvement in his current predicament. From how you describe it, he cannot hold his parents accountable for their actions. He's got an ACE score of three at the minimum. You wrote that you are both going to therapy. Has his family been discussed? Has yours?

 

It is a relief to know he's not being abusive of your daughter.

[Merrifield]

The situation is not impossible. You can do whatever you want to do.

Agree 100%!

 

... What (if anything) can I do to support him in this without pushing him? ...

If you decide to stay, I would plant ideas like seeds. If his mind is fertile they will grow.

 

 

 

[somebody]

Overall, I see anger as a negative emotion. I don't know your full situation, but I would say play an active role that sets yourself up for success - emotionally, physically, spiritually, hypothetically, realistically. 

peace and vibes. 

[kathryn]

I'm facing a similar situation with my husband, and I feel very conflicted. I discovered FDR through a friend about 2 months ago, and I've felt this urgency to change my life. I've been with my husband for 3 years (married for a year and a half), and we've developed all these destructive habits. A few weeks ago I felt so frustrated that I just wanted to end it and start fresh with someone else, but I was convinced to try couples therapy for a month before I make a decision.

The sad truth is that the more he opens up the more I feel he is not the man I want to start a family with. I don't feel attracted to his virtues... He was dishonest with me for such a long time about his feelings that I don't trust the alleged honesty he is bringing to therapy. His deep fears make me question his capacity for courage. I keep asking myself why I married this man, and then I remember that we each had a parent die over the last three years and going through the grieving process together made me feel very attached to him. Also, my parents loved him, and I've had a compulsive need for my parents approval my entire life.

 

So, I can relate to your conflict... I have not come up with a solution yet though. I've just been trying to be patient and allow him a reasonable time to grow because he says he wants to change. Does your partner express a desire to change? 

[MMX2010]

He was dishonest with me for such a long time about his feelings that I don't trust the alleged honesty he is bringing to therapy. His deep fears make me question his capacity for courage.

 

 

 

Dishonest how?  (It's important, but if you don't want to share, I understand.)

[Huldra]

 

I can’t go and I can’t stay

 

I just wanted to chime in and say I can relate, and you're not alone. Relationship ambivilance has been a huge source of anxiety for me. I'm 26 and have only had two relationships - but now that it's getting really serious I'm questioning if I can really make an informed decision with a "lack of experience/references" in dating; I keep questioning if he is "right" for me. For all I know it's just fear speaking.

 

Sorry I don't know what to say that can help, but I'm curious what advice others here may have for you.

[kathryn]

Dishonest how?  (It's important, but if you don't want to share, I understand.)

He is being dishonest about his own feelings and opinions. In therapy and in discussions, I feel like he is just telling me what he thinks I want l hear rather than what is really in his head. He just agrees with what ever I say even if I'm being irrational and emotional, and tells me he is "fine" when I know he really isn't. It's like he's playing this sort of martyr, willing to sacrifice his own happiness for mine, but it's just making me feel angry, resentful, and guilty.

 

There's other stuff too, but that's the most pressing issue for me right now...

[bitcoin]

I'm facing a similar situation with my husband, and I feel very conflicted. I discovered FDR through a friend about 2 months ago, and I've felt this urgency to change my life. I've been with my husband for 3 years (married for a year and a half), and we've developed all these destructive habits. A few weeks ago I felt so frustrated that I just wanted to end it and start fresh with someone else, but I was convinced to try couples therapy for a month before I make a decision.

 

The sad truth is that the more he opens up the more I feel he is not the man I want to start a family with. I don't feel attracted to his virtues... He was dishonest with me for such a long time about his feelings that I don't trust the alleged honesty he is bringing to therapy. His deep fears make me question his capacity for courage. I keep asking myself why I married this man, and then I remember that we each had a parent die over the last three years and going through the grieving process together made me feel very attached to him. Also, my parents loved him, and I've had a compulsive need for my parents approval my entire life.

 

So, I can relate to your conflict... I have not come up with a solution yet though. I've just been trying to be patient and allow him a reasonable time to grow because he says he wants to change. Does your partner express a desire to change? 

Woah. I am so sorry to hear that Kathryn. It sounds like you are currently doing therapy with your current partner? Have you done / considered doing it alone, for yourself. You bring up some great questions, patterns and potential issues which sounds like you could benefit tremendously from working through in therapy. 

Again, I am so sorry to hear about your situation. I can't imagine being so invested in a relationships and finding out he may not be the right person for you. That is incredibly tragic and heartbreaking. My heart goes out to you and I really wish you the best. 

[QueechoFeecho]

That kind of behavior will probably lead to a future doubling-down on the prior behaviors after a short period of acting like those behaviors aren't what they want to do.  Maybe I'm forecasting too much.

[Mothra]

I'm facing a similar situation with my husband, and I feel very conflicted. I discovered FDR through a friend about 2 months ago, and I've felt this urgency to change my life. I've been with my husband for 3 years (married for a year and a half), and we've developed all these destructive habits. A few weeks ago I felt so frustrated that I just wanted to end it and start fresh with someone else, but I was convinced to try couples therapy for a month before I make a decision.

 

The sad truth is that the more he opens up the more I feel he is not the man I want to start a family with. I don't feel attracted to his virtues... He was dishonest with me for such a long time about his feelings that I don't trust the alleged honesty he is bringing to therapy. His deep fears make me question his capacity for courage. I keep asking myself why I married this man, and then I remember that we each had a parent die over the last three years and going through the grieving process together made me feel very attached to him. Also, my parents loved him, and I've had a compulsive need for my parents approval my entire life.

 

So, I can relate to your conflict... I have not come up with a solution yet though. I've just been trying to be patient and allow him a reasonable time to grow because he says he wants to change. Does your partner express a desire to change? 

 

Some things he wants to change. But he doesn't take the necessary action to do those things. Or maybe he doesn't know what that is? It's like there is this continual input needed from me or he just returns to default.

 

Other things I'm not sure if he wants to change. It's so hard to get him to open up. That's the biggest challenge I think is that he is so shut down. Whenever I ask him about his feelings he gives 2 word answers and that's the end of the story. It's amazing because he can wax on about any topic, but when it comes to his emotions it's just crickets. He says he doesn't like dwelling on negative emotions because that just stresses him out. But what he defines as dwelling I define as analyzing.

 

So all the potential solutions are me brainstorming, he gives hardly any feedback, other than the occasional "okay." I feel like I'm trying to solve this alone and with no guidance from him, which doesn't help.

 

Sorry to hear you're in a similar situation. I hope some of this helps you too.

[MMX2010]

Some things he wants to change. But he doesn't take the necessary action to do those things. Or maybe he doesn't know what that is? It's like there is this continual input needed from me or he just returns to default.

 

Other things I'm not sure if he wants to change. It's so hard to get him to open up. That's the biggest challenge I think is that he is so shut down. Whenever I ask him about his feelings he gives 2 word answers and that's the end of the story. It's amazing because he can wax on about any topic, but when it comes to his emotions it's just crickets. He says he doesn't like dwelling on negative emotions because that just stresses him out. But what he defines as dwelling I define as analyzing.

 

So all the potential solutions are me brainstorming, he gives hardly any feedback, other than the occasional "okay." I feel like I'm trying to solve this alone and with no guidance from him, which doesn't help.

 

Sorry to hear you're in a similar situation. I hope some of this helps you too.

 

 

You might be stuck in a "Frame War". 

 

Are you sure it's emotions that he's avoiding, or is he avoiding emotions in response to specific topics that you want to analyze?  

 

What topics do you discuss that he avoids?  And does he get emotional over "stupid shit", like the way I do regarding my favorite hockey team?