Ed888 Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 I was wondering how many people in the FDR community lift weights and if they would be able to offer me some insight on my current situation? I've been lifting weights for about a year now and I'm having difficulty finding a new routine that fits my schedule and requirements for the gym, and also some concerns on diet. So far I've done SS, some random splits to get me familiar with other exercises, Jonnie Candito's 6 week program, and a program I'm on right now called Bulldog powerbuilding split. Currently, my requirements for a program is that it's 3 days per week and is on Sunday, Monday, and Wednsday (I have a class I attend on these days hence why they're so specific) and I get my weights and sparring done on these days. My numbers have been stagnating lately and my current routine isn't leaving me feeling confident in feeling like I know what I'm doing. I'm also concerned that doing the core lifts for so long I need something else to stress my muscles since they're probably used to doing squats for the 10,000th time. My main goal is to gain strength and improve my core lifts, so I've been doing powerlifting routines for the most part. I've been successful in putting on mass however I'm looking to cut the excess bodyfat I took on while getting bigger and I've heard left and right stories on cutting/bulking and it being possible to keep making gains while losing fat. This is a frequent issue I've found in doing my homework and wanted to hear if anyone has a take on how to go about preserving/improving muscle mass while taking steps towards shedding fat. Current 1RM estimates (in lbs) Bench: ~130 Squat: ~200 Military Press: ~90 Deadlift: ~260 (With straps) TL;DR Any powerlifters here with good 3 day program recommendations? Any and all help/insight would be greatly appreciated. 1
algernon Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 Ed, this is a good subject. The first questions I would like to ask are your age, weight and height. Based on you doing SS, and have been lifting for a year, coupled with your current lifts I would say - NDTP = not doing the program. I'm also concerned that doing the core lifts for so long I need something else to stress my muscles since they're probably used to doing squats for the 10,000th time. This statement leads me to believe you may not have a real clear understanding of the stress - recovery cycle of an organism, which in this case happens to be your muscles. Let's dispel a myth - Muscle Confusion (I actually heard Stef bring this up once, I cried briefly), the only thing that is being confused in this case is the lifter, because they clearly do not understand what they're doing. It's actually extremely simple, so simple in fact I would say that makes it hard for people to grasp. We want things to be complex when they are not. You get stronger by continually increasing the load, and allow proper time for rest (sleeping) and recovery (calories). These are the only things that matter. I've heard left and right stories on cutting/bulking and it being possible to keep making gains while losing fat. This is definitely possible, but usually under only two circumstances. You are either a novice and any stimulus will result increased strength and muscle mass, since your normal state is so under conditioned the worst strength program will give you results, which is extremely confusing for most people because the results are not continuous. And the second scenario is taking steroids - not recommended. It is very possible to gain considerable strength and size, while gaining minimal fat. When my serious strength journey began a few years ago I thought to myself, I'll gain the strength and then lose the fat, what I came to find out is I prefer continuing to gain strength and the extra fat is less important to me. Unless you are at an unhealthy level, who cares? I think for every goal it makes sense to ask why, why is this my goal? 2
Guest Gee Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 Terrible structure, apologies. If your stagnating try taking a week or two very with very light weight, tech session at 50% max, then hit it hard again for 8 weeks. Please stop changing programs, growth comes from progressive overload and rest. You can make strength gains from training your nervous system whilst losing weight. You can progressively overload the weight in at a very high percentage of your max and do your speed work, you'll lift more and lift it and faster. Your not going to make any sort of mass gains losing weight. Any one who does will be either a fat noob or on steroids, either way don't train with them, don't even look at them. https://www.defrancostraining.com/westside-for-skinny-bastards-part1/ This program plus a little bit of sled dragging or stair sprinting is very effective, the principles allowed me to get very strong. Pro tier: Olympic style squats if you can do them. Snatch grip dead lift if you can do them. Get a training partner who is better than you and very competitive, get more if you can. God tier: Get a coach. When I trained for rugby; Squat = 260 x5 Bench = 160 x1 Deadlift = 270 x1 Jerk = 170 Body weight = 110 Numbers are in kilos. Why are you training, what are you training for? Start setting weight goals as a function of your body weight, other forms are meaningless. 1
cager Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 kinobody.com https://kinobody.com/workouts-and-exercises/henry-cavill-workout/ He designs workouts specifically for what you want. Lift heavy with low reps, reduce calories using intermittent fasting.
Jake Danczyk Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 Can you give us your height & weight Ed? Would help in evaluating where you are at.
Ed888 Posted January 10, 2016 Author Posted January 10, 2016 Can you give us your height & weight Ed? Would help in evaluating where you are at. 5ft 6 inches ~170lbs @Graham Is it? I kind of did all of this stuff by myself via hours and hours and hours of forums, videos, books, and the like so direct feedback isn't something I ever had in abundance, I've become skeptical as a result of all this homework since it seems like the opinions and philosophies vary so far that you can pretty much find whatever answer you want and just get lost for days with all the charts and research people argue with. If it's any relief, the programs in my list that are not SS and Candito I did for the longest, the others I've done for maybe around 1 month, main ones I did for about 5-6. I did do snatch grip deadlifts for a little while in the candito program but I have short arms and my back kept rounding whenever I expanded my grip to anything wider than narrow. For squats I haven't tried olympic, I've mainly done low bar squats and recently trying to get my flexibility and form going for front squats, I'll look into it more though I'm training because it's become a decent hobby for me at this point and helps keep my mind grounded and builds up confidence, I'm not with any specific sport or any meetup but I want the pieces of my body to do what they do well if that makes sense. It's not the most ambitious or specific goal but it's what I've went with so far. kinobody.com https://kinobody.com/workouts-and-exercises/henry-cavill-workout/ He designs workouts specifically for what you want. Lift heavy with low reps, reduce calories using intermittent fasting. Yeah I've been doing sets with 5-6 reps for the most part. I've reduced my calories from ~2200/day to ~1900/day 170g of protein 30/35/35 for macros. I never tried fasting but I'll do some homework on it.
wdiaz03 Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 Hi Ed, I've been lifting for 25 years or so, If there's something I've learned is that its important to ground yourself and really figure out what you want and what you are willing to pay to get it. I realized quickly when I started that I was not going to compete so extreme muscles and strength took a back seat and I focused on looking and being fit. That said, I focused on major muscles group and typical routines, I picked up mine from an Arnold book I had when I started. Chest-Triceps, Back-Biceps, Shoulder-Legs, 5 sets with increasing weight. I'v seen nasty injuries at the gym from those who take it to the extreme. split biceps, split pecs, steroids and its effects. I myself had had to deal with joint issues, from lack of stretching as per the therapist. I don't know what would work for you, a lot of it might be genetics. But my 2 cents is to find something you enjoy and that you can stick to. I have seen too many get results then quit and loose it all back, Best of luck, and congrats on your path to fitness.
Ed888 Posted January 10, 2016 Author Posted January 10, 2016 Whoops, forgot to respond to Algernon, sorry. I posted the other stuff previous but I forgot to mention my age, I'm 24 and have no health conditions or prior injuries whatsoever. And yeah, I didn't follow Rippetoe's insight to the T, I used the program but I didn't do GOMAD or eat a crap ton of food since I read a crap ton of skepticism generated from SS being so famous/infamous and some authority figures saying it's good but not to the results Rippetoe claims. ie: Scooby saying it's good but projected strength gains were unrealistic. So instead of stepping up to the impossible task of trying to filter what was criticism, what was true, and what was shitposting, I just did the program with a caloric surplus and ate enough protein. Maybe I left gains on the table, maybe I should of said fuck it 100% to the idea of getting fat while doing SS, but keep in mind this was just me having what I could synthesize off of the internet and no people or friends to actually give me any insight, warnings, or input. All my friends were usually skeletons or just fat. I've been lifting for 25 years or so Damn Pinkhat, that's a whoole lotta years. I appreciate your say btw. Finding something I "enjoy" is kind of a hard thing to say because the thing I'd want most in a routine is that it's 3 day, gets me strong, and is minimalist and efficient as possible, so I was looking at 5/3/1 but I keep reading that's more of an intermediate and I think I'm still more of a novice/DYEL now just becoming beginner. I can stick to anything once I get over the initial friction of learning new forms correctly and whatever other homework it requires though, just not crossfit. That stuff's dangerous and or goofy as hell looking.
wdiaz03 Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 Whoops, forgot to respond to Algernon, sorry. I posted the other stuff previous but I forgot to mention my age, I'm 24 and have no health conditions or prior injuries whatsoever. And yeah, I didn't follow Rippetoe's insight to the T, I used the program but I didn't do GOMAD or eat a crap ton of food since I read a crap ton of skepticism generated from SS being so famous/infamous and some authority figures saying it's good but not to the results Rippetoe claims. ie: Scooby saying it's good but projected strength gains were unrealistic. So instead of stepping up to the impossible task of trying to filter what was criticism, what was true, and what was shitposting, I just did the program with a caloric surplus and ate enough protein. Maybe I left gains on the table, maybe I should of said fuck it 100% to the idea of getting fat while doing SS, but keep in mind this was just me having what I could synthesize off of the internet and no people or friends to actually give me any insight, warnings, or input. All my friends were usually skeletons or just fat. Damn Pinkhat, that's a whoole lotta years. I appreciate your say btw. Finding something I "enjoy" is kind of a hard thing to say because the thing I'd want most in a routine is that it's 3 day, gets me strong, and is minimalist and efficient as possible, so I was looking at 5/3/1 but I keep reading that's more of an intermediate and I think I'm still more of a novice/DYEL now just becoming beginner. I can stick to anything once I get over the initial friction of learning new forms correctly and whatever other homework it requires though, just not crossfit. That stuff's dangerous and or goofy as hell looking. No problem, I'll PM you some pics so you know what I mean. Those pictures are of me about 3 years ago. and doing nothing fancy, Only supplement was multivitamins and whey protein about 40g a day. I did cut carbs (no sugar, breads, grains etc) only vegetables and salad with the meat to drop the fat. I'm about 5'10" 5'11" depending on the time of day and between 170 to 180lb. On those pictures I went below 170lb. The important thing is that I'm comfortable with those results. I'm not at the level of Elliott Hulse by no means, nor I want to if I have to put in massive amounts of time and effort. But keep in mind that I'm 39 on the pictures. 1
algernon Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 Hi Ed, Unfortunately there is a pervasiveness of misinformation regarding Rippetoe and his program. There are experts all over the place making arguments against claims he's never made. Taking GOMAD for an example, it has never been recommended for someone at a healthy weight to do GOMAD, it has always been the severely underweight younger male. My brother was a perfect example, at 18, weighing 130lb at 5'10" and struggling to pick up a 5 gallon bucket of water, he needed GOMAD. You at 24, being 5'6" and 170, no one would recommend that. You do need enough calories to recover, and gain weight, you do not need to be drinking a gallon of milk daily though. I've been interested in fitness and strength training for well over 15 years, it wasn't until the last 3 to 4 years I was able to actually fully comprehend what it took to achieve constant results. I have read almost every program and opinion out there, I came to the conclusion on Rippetoe being the best due to the philosophical approach he takes on it. If someone wants me to do something a certain way I want to know why, and he is the only person that can consistently explain that. There are two things that it takes to be a good coach, having achieved a level of success doing the thing you are coaching, and being able to explain why you do it the way you do to other people. Those genetically gifted, being the top athletes in their field rarely make a good coach, they are good athletes because they are dedicated, can follow instruction and have the genes for it, that does not mean they can teach. I wasted a lot of time following the advice of the guys that could bench 500lbs, or deadlift 800, unfortunately because they can do that, does not mean they know how to teach other people to do it. If someone says to do something a certain way, just keep asking why, if they cannot explain why I would suspect they do not fully understand themself, which is not good advice. I would recommend reading his latest book on the subject of programming, Practical Programming for Strength Training 3. Of course you need to have a good grasp on proper form as found in Starting Strength. I would also suggest to either find someone local that knows the program to critique your form, or post form check videos. Countless number of people think they have the correct form and once reviewed are very far off base. A few years back I went to a Starting Strength seminar and it was well worth the money and the 3 days it took. Not only do they teach you the lifts and the reasoning behind everything on an anatomical level, they teach you how to teach it, if you cannot teach someone else what to do, you do not fully understand it. By the way, you're the same height as Ed Coan, one of the best powerlifters, ever. 2
Jake Danczyk Posted January 10, 2016 Posted January 10, 2016 Thanks for the info Ed, this is my advice. Some is likely a repeat of stuff you have read elsewhere, apologies in advance. (And I didnt mean to write this much when I started, it just wouldnt stop ) You have gained some strength and are no longer a novice, but are still in the beginner category, and a little overweight, so I you will be able to gain strength through increased neural efficiency while maintaining or even losing weight. A program with linear progression (adding a set amount of weight each time) and a small number of basic compound lifts will be the simplest and fastest way to gain strength. Something like Starting Strength or StrongLifts, but since you are going to lift on Sundays and Mondays, you should do an upper/lower split those days rather than full body. I know you said you have done SS, but I think you could still milk a lot more gains out of it or similar program. Diet Just aim to get your ~1g/lb of bodyweight Protein. I find that eating this amount of protein keeps me rather full and around maintenance without having to also track Carbs and Fat, though you should still avoid sugary snacks (no more than a few servings a week). You could do cyclical diet and minimize Carb consumption Thursday-Saturday to help shed some fat. Workout Sunday: 5 sets of 3 on Deadlift. Optional: 2-3 sets of 6-12 reps on Leg Extension, Calf Raises(Something where you leg is straight, not bent), Weighted Crunches Monday: 3 sets of 5 on Bench Press and Barbell rows. Optional: 2-3 sets of 6-12 reps on Lat pulldowns, Fly's, Curls, Triceps Extensions, 1-2 sets of 6-12 reps Front/Side/Rear Shoulder raises Wednesday: 3 sets of 5 on Squat, Incline Bench Press, Weighted Chin Ups(or Chin-up grip on the lat pulldown) Optional: 2-3 sets of 6-12 reps on Leg Curls Get your body/heart warmed up before lifting with 2-5 minutes of cardio or bodyweight exercises. For the main lifts: Start with a weight 15-20% less than the most you think you could finish the workouts with. Increase weight by 5 pounds each week. You should aim to hit your current limits in 4 weeks. Use the same weight for all working sets. On the last set, if you can do more than 5 reps, keep going until you aren't sure you will be able to finish the next one. Warm your joints up by doing singles up to and slightly over your working weight. Rest ~3 minutes between upper body sets, a little longer for legs. For the Deadlift, DO NOT EVER COMPROMISE FORM to try to get another rep or 2, you will hurt your back. Drop to 3 sets of 3 on Deads when/if you reach the point where you cannot finish all 5 sets, then continue progressing linearly. Squat to at least parallel. Most of us westerners need to also spend time in a low squat position outside the gym to gain the mobility needed to squat to/below parallel. Put 5# plates under your heels if you cannot squat to parallel standing flatfooted You can superset the Pressing and Pulling exercises if you want to reduce the overall time in the gym. Hopefully I haven't missed anything though definitely ask any questions you may have. I think you will be able to follow this program for 12+ weeks and gain 20% or more on your lifts before you begin hitting a wall. This will happen sooner with some exercises then others, continue until you are not making any progress. If you are not able to continue progressing past week 4(your current limits) then either: You are eating too far below maintenance calories and your body has been losing weight too rapidly to maintain/grow strength I am wrong, you are not as much of a beginner as I believe, and you will need to be eating a surplus to gain strength in the future. In this case you may wish to cut first and drop ~20 pounds before returning to a strength-gain phase. My resume: 25yo, been lifting for ~9 years but only been making sustained progress for ~3 years. In that time, gone from bodyweight of 190@ ~16% bodyfat to 225@ ~9% bodyfat. Best lifts in pounds: 300 Weighted Chin Up, 280 Bench Press, 415 Squat, 535 Deadlift 1
Ed888 Posted January 11, 2016 Author Posted January 11, 2016 By the way, you're the same height as Ed Coan, one of the best powerlifters, ever. And the same first name too. pretty spook Also has anyone heard much of the routines from the book "Education of a Bodybuilder" by Arnold Schwarzenegger? Was talking to Pink hat about it, wanted to see what other folk's thoughts on it are. Practical programming looks a lot like SS in movements, is it really just all compound stuff and no assist movements? No rows, or arms or anything? SS was great as a base since the core lifts will follow you for the rest of your life, but I thought more dance moves had to come in with following routines? Also what would be sufficient calories on workout days? An extra scoop of whey and some 350 or so calories? I get answers all over the place when I try blogs and online sources, the only nailed down answer I got is to not to drop below your needed amount of protein and not to skimp on the carbs for when your body needs it to exert the force for the lifts. Thanks everyone for your insight so far btw.
wdiaz03 Posted January 11, 2016 Posted January 11, 2016 And the same first name too. pretty spook Also has anyone heard much of the routines from the book "Education of a Bodybuilder" by Arnold Schwarzenegger? Was talking to Pink hat about it, wanted to see what other folk's thoughts on it are. Practical programming looks a lot like SS in movements, is it really just all compound stuff and no assist movements? No rows, or arms or anything? SS was great as a base since the core lifts will follow you for the rest of your life, but I thought more dance moves had to come in with following routines? Also what would be sufficient calories on workout days? An extra scoop of whey and some 350 or so calories? I get answers all over the place when I try blogs and online sources, the only nailed down answer I got is to not to drop below your needed amount of protein and not to skimp on the carbs for when your body needs it to exert the force for the lifts. Thanks everyone for your insight so far btw. My two cents, I have never counted calories. I counted grams of protein. and tried to keep it close to 1g per lb of body weight. taken in no more than 30g per meal. adding a whole egg with 2 egg whites for breakfast some tuna from a can for lunch or chicken whey protein for snack or hard boiled eggs meat for diner yogurt for snack That's it. I also watched the carbs since I tend to pack fat easily. so ( only veggies and salads) and easy on the fruits. Again it depends on what you are going for, I for example consider Michelangelo's David an acceptable physique. But some people might want to have bulging muscles and then there might be further things to consider. BTW.It looks like the system ate my prior reply.
algernon Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 You have gained some strength and are no longer a novice, but are still in the beginner category, and a little overweight. Based on the information presented how did you make that determination?
hermitcrab Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 Intensity is a very important factor. Perfect form and routines do not build muscle. They are good to know, but to make any significant gains you also have to push yourself hard. You need to put intensity and aggression into your lifting. Be determined, be focused. Put your max effort into every rep (after you've done your warm up). Even if you are doing lighter weights, try to move the weight as fast as possible. Don't be afraid of failure. Keep adding more weight each week until you fail (with safety). Believe you can lift more. I've been lifting for off and on for 15 years, weigh 160, bench 325, deadlift 425 while spending just 1 to 3 hours per week in the gym. Most of my recent strength gains came after watching videos of Louie Simmons and Westside Barbell. Spend only 30 minutes in the gym, but work your ass off for those 30 minutes. Generally I work each muscle group one time per week. If I want to make serious gains, I'll work to same muscle group two days in a row, then rest that group for 6 days, and repeat. Pre and post-workout Celltech, or creatine and sugar help to make gains, as well as whey. If you want to build muscle, join a gym with serious lifters. I always work out harder when there are serious lifters in the gym, competitive pressure. The Planet Fitness commercials make me laugh because the guys they make fun are clearly experts in lifting, but instead of wanting to learn something from them, they ban them. Get you burn on bro! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rn5mzEAMAkY
Anuojat Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 I ummm lift? Yeah... Not much but i do. Dont squat thought, not at all. Instead ill use captains chair and lift weights while lying down in bed/bench Does back reeeeeeal good
Jake Danczyk Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 (edited) Based on the information presented how did you make that determination? Current 1RM estimates (in lbs) Bench: ~130 Squat: ~200 Military Press: ~90 Deadlift: ~260 (With straps) 5ft 6 inches ~170lbs http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/DeadliftStandards.html http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/BenchStandards.html http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/SquatStandards.html BMI of 27.4, which is in the overweight category. Also felt that was reasonable to say as it is the OP's own assessment that he is likely a beginner lifter. Also based on my own experience that once I began eating sufficiently and training with a similar program to the one I posted that strength gains came consistently and linearly until I got to about (5 rep on all) 0.9x bodyweight bench, 1.4x bodyweight squat, 1.7x bodyweight deadlift. I do owe you an apology though Ed, my reply was written extremely mechanically, and the truth is I was using the chance to totally focus on numbers/logic of programming to avoid some painful emotions I did not want to face that night. And you should definitely do some reading of the true experts in the field as Algernon and Graham have suggested. In reply to your last post, I also felt that the lack of a Pulling exercise made SS unbalanced, so I added in rows and pull-up like movements. But compound lifts are definitely the best way to gain strength, the strongest guys in my gym (natural and steroid users alike) spend 80%+ of their time doing compound movements. I would recommend variations of the main lifts (for example I prefer Decline and Incline Bench to Flat bench, feels better on my shoulders somehow), Many of the specific details are not that important, the most important thing as a beginner is to know exactly what you did last time so you can consistently increase one aspect of loading each time you do the same workout. That can be increased weight, number of reps or sets, or decreased rest between sets, or a combination of these factors. The consistent but mild increase in difficulty gives your body the stimulus to adapt in small, achievable increments. When you push yourself to the edge of your strength, the next day you will actually be weaker (generally), but within a few days you will have become stronger (assuming you are eating enough). It is kinda like this: Push to 99% capacity, the next day that same loading would be 102% capacity(you couldnt do it), but 2 or 3 days later that same loading will be only 96% capacity, allowing you to push a little further. Was writing more but realized I was starting to repeat Algernon's first post. With diet, you do have decide your goal for the next few months. Focus on muscle and strength gain, or try to cut fat while minimizing muscle loss. If I am right and you are still a beginner it will be possible to lose weight and gain some more strength, but the strength gains will be from a better mind-body connection, not bigger muscles. I still recommend attempting to maintain weight and gaining strength until you stall again, but when you do stall, or if you are unable to gain more strength while maintaining weight, then I would begin cutting if I were you. There are many ways to cut. Atkins-style low to no carb, more balanced diets, eating the same but doing lots of cardio, and more. I would recommend this site, has very informative and well researched articles on large variety of topics, though is oriented more towards physique building than athletic performance. http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/ Edited January 12, 2016 by Jake Danczyk
Guest Gee Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 5ft 6 inches ~170lbs @Graham Is it? I kind of did all of this stuff by myself via hours and hours and hours of forums, videos, books, and the like so direct feedback isn't something I ever had in abundance, I've become skeptical as a result of all this homework since it seems like the opinions and philosophies vary so far that you can pretty much find whatever answer you want and just get lost for days with all the charts and research people argue with. If it's any relief, the programs in my list that are not SS and Candito I did for the longest, the others I've done for maybe around 1 month, main ones I did for about 5-6. I did do snatch grip deadlifts for a little while in the candito program but I have short arms and my back kept rounding whenever I expanded my grip to anything wider than narrow. For squats I haven't tried olympic, I've mainly done low bar squats and recently trying to get my flexibility and form going for front squats, I'll look into it more though I'm training because it's become a decent hobby for me at this point and helps keep my mind grounded and builds up confidence, I'm not with any specific sport or any meetup but I want the pieces of my body to do what they do well if that makes sense. It's not the most ambitious or specific goal but it's what I've went with so far. Yeah I've been doing sets with 5-6 reps for the most part. I've reduced my calories from ~2200/day to ~1900/day 170g of protein 30/35/35 for macros. I never tried fasting but I'll do some homework on it. I think if you look through the responses the common theme is... Progressive overload + sufficient rest + anyone saying you can have it all is lying + anyone who has it all is on steroids. Weightlifting really is, and credit to everyone else saying this as well, deceptively simple. I think your looking for an external cause for an internal issue. When I stared training in my teens I had coaches who introduced weight training and programs etc and all the information was right and everyone could follow them but everyone, myself included, plateaued very early. The thing is training to get strong is training to really push the boundary of what you are capable of and for me, that ment I had to be trained how to train by someone who knew how to do this. Its kind of like a change in your approach to what your doing, you have get very comfortable with failure and that means being in an environment where you can fail (i mean literally fail and have to ditch the bar and accept this as a part of training). I think if you want to be strong you need to learn how to train to be strong and I think you need to get a coach (not a PT, a coach) who can train you on how to train. The way I would do this if I was you would be to put wednesday as my day of max effort work and have a coach there to train you through your limits. The habbits will spill over into your non-max effort sessions. With regards to the core lifts vs fluff. The way I think about it is like this, the core lifts are the movement that get you strong, the rest of the lifting is designed to supplement the core lifts, they are usfull fluff for conditioning parts of your body that need to be brought into balance. Again, don't believe the hype and I think you need a coach to train you. Your along way from strong and you get there by consistently good training. p.s. if you want dance moves consider olympic lifting (i am bias). This is Pyrros Dimas, he is 5"7 and 180lb.
Losilluminati Posted January 12, 2016 Posted January 12, 2016 Stick to 1 linear program ! Jumping from 1 program(doesnt matter which) to another way too early is hurting your lifts. Ive also been doing SS for about a year and this video is 100% on point. I could have progressed much quicker if I followed his basic advice. My height is 183cm. I went from 165lbs>195lbs>180lbs(present) Squat 3x5 265lbs Bench 3x5 140 Deadlift 1x5 275 OHP 3x5 90 Rows 3x10 140 I had a bunch of random months off lifting due to injuries/work schedule/laziness. Besides that the main reasons why I stalled/had to deload many times if because my diet has been inconsistent, I had many days where I ate under 100g of protein and many days of under 6hr sleep. This year im going to keep a closer eye on my macros, sleep more, lift more. Hope this helps. Also lose the straps with such baby weights. Do double over hand until your grip fails then switch to overunder/hook grip.
gemccarty Posted January 13, 2016 Posted January 13, 2016 Ed and FDR listeners, feel free to email me with personal fitness questions: [email protected]. In reply to the above posts, Here's how programming works: Compare desired adaptation to current state of the body. Compare current stimuli to biological principles. Adjust stimuli based upon biological principles, and in relation to desired adaptation. Compare resulting adaptation to desired adaptation. Adjust stimuli based upon comparison of resulting and desired adaptation. Repeat 4&5 until desired adaptation is achieved. Proper guidance is not prescription based upon biological principles alone, but discovery of the individual stimuli combination needed to achieve the desired adaptation. There is no quick answer unless you have exceptional genetics, use drugs, or are willing to accept higher body fat.
Ed888 Posted January 13, 2016 Author Posted January 13, 2016 Also lose the straps with such baby weights. Do double over hand until your grip fails then switch to overunder/hook grip. My grip is really narrow on the bar to where I can't get a full grip of where your hands are supposed to be, my hands grasp a lot of the completely smooth portion of the barbell and then once I begin the lift quickly begin to sweat profusely and just slips out of my hands. I can get up to two plate with an over under grip before my over hand starts to slip and the gym I'm at doesn't let you use chalk either. The video was insightful, I've seen a good amount of Alan before, his tutorials are fantastic. I'm incredibly lazy with the kitchen work so I mainly eat the same handful of recipes over and over and somehow not go insane to where I'm not too worried about the consistency of my protein intake so it's mainly just what Rippetoe called in the beginning which is being pulled between wanting to be lean and giving the body what it actually needs to match the increased stress loads. It's tempting since I can notice my chest isn't a rack of bones with a gut below it anymore but I still look like crap. I do also get enough sleep either 8-9 hours on days off or at least 7 1/2 with a 45 minute nap somewhere in the middle on other days. @Graham Yeah, I definitely got some of the misconceptions I had beginning this thread out of my head now. Many of the specific details are not that important, the most important thing as a beginner is to know exactly what you did last time so you can consistently increase one aspect of loading each time you do the same workout. That can be increased weight, number of reps or sets, or decreased rest between sets, or a combination of these factors. The consistent but mild increase in difficulty gives your body the stimulus to adapt in small, achievable increments. When you push yourself to the edge of your strength, the next day you will actually be weaker (generally), but within a few days you will have become stronger (assuming you are eating enough). It is kinda like this: Push to 99% capacity, the next day that same loading would be 102% capacity(you couldnt do it), but 2 or 3 days later that same loading will be only 96% capacity, allowing you to push a little further. Was writing more but realized I was starting to repeat Algernon's first post. With diet, you do have decide your goal for the next few months. Focus on muscle and strength gain, or try to cut fat while minimizing muscle loss. If I am right and you are still a beginner it will be possible to lose weight and gain some more strength, but the strength gains will be from a better mind-body connection, not bigger muscles. I still recommend attempting to maintain weight and gaining strength until you stall again, but when you do stall, or if you are unable to gain more strength while maintaining weight, then I would begin cutting if I were you. There are many ways to cut. Atkins-style low to no carb, more balanced diets, eating the same but doing lots of cardio, and more. I would recommend this site, has very informative and well researched articles on large variety of topics, though is oriented more towards physique building than athletic performance. http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/ Thanks, so it sounds like go back to linear progression. I thought I burnt all that up with SS or the first 6-7 months of lifting. If you want to build muscle, join a gym with serious lifters. I always work out harder when there are serious lifters in the gym, competitive pressure. The Planet Fitness commercials make me laugh because the guys they make fun are clearly experts in lifting, but instead of wanting to learn something from them, they ban them. Get you burn on bro! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rn5mzEAMAkY Oh don't worry, the gym I'm at is filled with He-men, yoga's that can bend so much they'd make Gumby look like a piece of stale laffy taffy, and a good number of amazonian chicks who look like they can curl just as much as the guys. I've come a long way from just looking around and seeing the usual walking dead on the tv treadmills. I sure miss the $10/month thing though
algernon Posted January 13, 2016 Posted January 13, 2016 I would also agree with losing the straps. Why are your hands so narrowly placed that they are on the smooth portion of the barbell? Unless you have barbell with an unusually wide portion lacking knurling I would bring your hands out, they should be about shoulder width apart. I pulled over under for most of my lifting and started noticing some pretty visible asymmetry in my back, I would strongly suggest doing all of your pulls with a double overhand until it starts to slip (oh, and GET CHALK), then use a hook grip. If you start with a hook grip now, it will be bearable when you are pulling 400 and 500. Oh, and get chalk, that cannot be stressed enough. The easiest thing to do is pick up one of those rock climbing chalk balls, it's chalk inside of a sock basically, very clean and seems to last forever. Jake, the reason I asked about novice is because I wanted to make sure I hadn't missed anything, but based on the information we've been given I do not feel comfortable making that determination. Strength standards are extremely arbitrary and really don't mean anything, you have some people that have never lifted weights and could be considered in the intermediate or advanced stage, yet still be able to make "novice" like gains with lifting. This is a really good article on the subject - http://startingstrength.com/articles/be_novice_rippetoe.pdf The reason I bring this up, I'd hate for someone to not train like a "novice" and leave rapid gains on the table, because they think they are beyond that stage. Follow a properly designed program with adequate rest and calories, and add weight like a novice until you can no longer recover, then consider an intermediate style program.
Ed888 Posted January 13, 2016 Author Posted January 13, 2016 (oh, and GET CHALK), then use a hook grip. If you start with a hook grip now, it will be bearable when you are pulling 400 and 500. Oh, and get chalk, that cannot be stressed enough. The easiest thing to do is pick up one of those rock climbing chalk I do have chalk, but... and the gym I'm at doesn't let you use chalk either. I managed to sneak it a few times but I got caught once and don't want to push my luck. The stuff is so obnoxiously messy too it's like a smokescreen gadget out of a James Bond movie. Really sucks because the times I did use it I could deadlift much closer to my strap numbers. None of the gym's I've been to seem to let you use chalk.
Losilluminati Posted January 15, 2016 Posted January 15, 2016 I also go to a gym that doesnt allow chalk. But i keep it in a Tupperware in my gym bag. Maybe try being more sneaky ? Besides they will pretty much let you get away with murder before kicking you out. They want that $$$
Ed888 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Posted January 15, 2016 I have no experience with this but went to a climbing gym recently and noticed they allow chalk balls, not loose chalk. I wonder if that might be less conspicuous? http://www.amazon.com/Z-Athletic-Gymnastics-Climbing-Weight-Lifting/dp/B001KGA1L6/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1452829288&sr=8-3&keywords=chalk+ball I'm not buying more chalk, I already made the big mistake of buying the value pack off amazon to where I will need to have to lift for the rest of my life and have at least 2 of my future children to lift for half of theirs before I will use it all. I also go to a gym that doesnt allow chalk. But i keep it in a Tupperware in my gym bag. Maybe try being more sneaky ? Besides they will pretty much let you get away with murder before kicking you out. They want that $$$ I'd rather not push my luck. The gym I go to I attend martial arts classes after I get my lifts done and if I'm not quite ready to say I've had my fill of it. (I also don't want to go shopping around again for an instructor who has at least 5 missing teeth of experience)
jamcity Posted January 20, 2016 Posted January 20, 2016 As a practitioner of martial arts these repetitive brute strength exercises never really appealed to me. Excitement aside I would prefer to remain flexible. Outside of gears of war aesthetics I do not see this as the best fitness strategy. I like to discard whatever isn't useful, a notable example is the lack of; mobility, flexibility, and diminished striking/raw power.Recent innovations in kinesiology support this, just look at how successful Stanford U became in athletics based on sensible training.Maybe you need a more balanced approach, I try to incorporate the philosophy of JKD in my training to constantly evolve what is out of balance. My exercise is apart of my JKD training, which supports my entire life style- all things are connected so nothing is ever pursued on its own. I will still go to MMA classes outside of that the same way I go to seminars outside of work put always as a supplementing material but never treat it individually by itself. If you train MMA for self defense you are missing a lot of the teachings, especially in their modern era. This is something the seemingly FDR has always been blind to with the attacks on combat training.
Jaime Posted January 20, 2016 Posted January 20, 2016 I strongly recommend you take a look a the website "aworkoutroutine". There you have absolutely everything you need to know about lifting focusing on gaining muscle mass, no bullshit (a very common thing when talking/reading about "putting on mass"). Even if hypertrophy is not your priority this site has really good explanations about exercises, splits, diet and whatnot, besides it's impossible to gain muscle without becoming stronger. Personally I used the beginner routine posted there during 9 months with great results.
Recommended Posts