Rule of the mob?

[ferro18]

So our votes worth the same??

https://youtu.be/CsxXty6vEBA

 

(just couple minutes vid don't worry)

[Mister Mister]

hilarious and fascinating and tragic...

[Worlok]

We just have to continue to educate people. They simply agree with who society told them to agree with. They need to be taught how to agree with what they actually think is right regardless of who says it.

[EclecticIdealist]

Yes, that's right. Most people treat selecting the supreme Executive Officer of the Nation as importantly as selecting the Student Body Class President in High School. Most also look at his job as being similar as well... getting the most "goodies" from the Powers that Be for the masses as they possibly can. The vast majority of Americans are woefully politically ignorant and apathetic.

[dsayers]

They need to be taught how to agree with what they actually think is right regardless of who says it.

Or better yet, to accept what is true regardless of what they THINK is right.

 

politically ignorant

Poisoning the well. Being politically aware beyond the fact that humans do not exist in different, opposing moral categories is a waste of resources.

[Worlok]

Or better yet, to accept what is true regardless of what they THINK is right.

 

 

 

Technically, you can only think something is true. Cogito, ergo sum is what I would call an exception to that rule. The way you put it implies that people should agree with that you tell them is true instead of what somebody else tells them is true. We can't convince people the truth by simply telling them what we think the truth is. We have to teach them how to find the truth themselves by teaching them how to think and supplying them with evidence.

[Will Torbald]

We just have to continue to educate people. They simply agree with who society told them to agree with. They need to be taught how to agree with what they actually think is right regardless of who says it.

 

You can't educate IQ into people. Voting will always be rigged to emotional arguments because only the very minority of high IQ people will make educated votes. Universal suffrage will always be a pre-IQ concept that will drag politics down for as long as it is implemented.

[Worlok]

You can't educate IQ into people. Voting will always be rigged to emotional arguments because only the very minority of high IQ people will make educated votes. Universal suffrage will always be a pre-IQ concept that will drag politics down for as long as it is implemented.

 

From what I have read, and you can decide to google it or not, fluid intelligence can grow, albeit temporarily through learning. From what I recall, a person can study and learn, and in doing so, their fluid intelligence will continue to grow so long as they study and learn. Use it or lose it sort of thing. I would liken it to weight lifting. So long as you lift, eat, and rest properly, your body will add muscle and retain it until you stop and go back to normal. That wasn't my initial argument, just a response to yours.

 

Children, and mentally retarded people are well known to understand that hitting is bad, that theft is bad. So long as they can learn economic and mathematic systems, they can apply moral reasoning. All you have to do is educate people and they can come to the moral conclusions. Either the person is morally bankrupt for liking communism or they lack information and need to be educated. If you consider logical reasoning to occur in steps, so long as a stupid person has the steps physically listed in front of them like a "times table," then they can come to the same conclusions as a highly intelligent individual that can devise new steps on his/her own. The less intelligent they are, the more plainly each step of logic must be expressed. This is why schooling has reading and visuals. I can get the gist of sciences I've never read of or heard of by reading or hearing about it once. Some people may need to hear it twice and some people may have to start at single digit addition and subtraction using their fingers. not being able to make and test conclusions does not mean that you can't read the conclusions and tests that others may put forward. Supply the information and supply it in the order in which it is required.

[dsayers]

We can't convince people the truth by simply telling them what we think the truth is. We have to teach them how to find the truth themselves by teaching them how to think and supplying them with evidence.

Agreed. My input only built off of your input by adding the necessary ingredient of acceptance for one's own capacity for error.

[Will Torbald]

From what I have read, and you can decide to google it or not, fluid intelligence can grow, albeit temporarily through learning. From what I recall, a person can study and learn, and in doing so, their fluid intelligence will continue to grow so long as they study and learn. Use it or lose it sort of thing. I would liken it to weight lifting. So long as you lift, eat, and rest properly, your body will add muscle and retain it until you stop and go back to normal. That wasn't my initial argument, just a response to yours.

 

Children, and mentally retarded people are well known to understand that hitting is bad, that theft is bad. So long as they can learn economic and mathematic systems, they can apply moral reasoning. All you have to do is educate people and they can come to the moral conclusions. Either the person is morally bankrupt for liking communism or they lack information and need to be educated. If you consider logical reasoning to occur in steps, so long as a stupid person has the steps physically listed in front of them like a "times table," then they can come to the same conclusions as a highly intelligent individual that can devise new steps on his/her own. The less intelligent they are, the more plainly each step of logic must be expressed. This is why schooling has reading and visuals. I can get the gist of sciences I've never read of or heard of by reading or hearing about it once. Some people may need to hear it twice and some people may have to start at single digit addition and subtraction using their fingers. not being able to make and test conclusions does not mean that you can't read the conclusions and tests that others may put forward. Supply the information and supply it in the order in which it is required.

 

I know it's not an argument, but this is just naive. I don't know where you live, but I don't think you have actual experience trying to educate low IQ people like I have. It's a fool's errand to try to transform an IQ 80 into a libertarian. If even the smartest people are statists and leftists as it happens with most scientists and philosophers, the idea that you can "times table" people into anarcho capitalism will implode when you try to execute it.

[Worlok]

I know it's not an argument, but this is just naive. I don't know where you live, but I don't think you have actual experience trying to educate low IQ people like I have. It's a fool's errand to try to transform an IQ 80 into a libertarian. If even the smartest people are statists and leftists as it happens with most scientists and philosophers, the idea that you can "times table" people into anarcho capitalism will implode when you try to execute it.

 

Have you been to Earth? The vast majority of people are uneducated, indoctrinated fools. Trying to have any discussion on anything, however trivial, is an experience in trying to educate low IQ people. I find the issue to be time, effort on behalf of the one being educated on learning, and my own access to multitudes of teaching tools to teach tools. I think a lot of us are here just to learn how to teach hairless apes better than we currently do.

 

Per the OP and obviously democracy, are you sure that you really want to say it can't be done and let tyrants rule?

[Will Torbald]

Have you been to Earth? The vast majority of people are uneducated, indoctrinated fools. Trying to have any discussion on anything, however trivial, is an experience in trying to educate low IQ people. I find the issue to be time, effort on behalf of the one being educated on learning, and my own access to multitudes of teaching tools to teach tools. I think a lot of us are here just to learn how to teach hairless apes better than we currently do.

 

Per the OP and obviously democracy, are you sure that you really want to say it can't be done and let tyrants rule?

It can be done in small steps. They can't take the whole enchilada at once. If you can't convince them to vote for slightly less government, it is impossible to convince them of no government. Also, there are limits. Your criteria are lack of education and presence of indoctrination - but if I tried to educate you right now into believing in communism and starting a revolution, you wouldn't take it. At some point the mind settles in and very few people can be converted. At another point a subject becomes too complex for a low or even middle IQ person to comprehend and all the education in he world can't fix that. You can't make me understand all the equations of general relativity and quantum mechanics by now, my brain just can't take it. It takes genius. So you either have to start very young and very bright in order to maintain a free society, or you have to artificially create it by physical removal of social parasites. You either go to a land and make it there, or you remove them from where you are and expel the commies and democrats. Or you take the super long and painful process of chipping away at the state little by little - not voting libertarian which hasn't and will never work - but by championing the candidate that can win and will turn the wheels towards the right just enough to have time to fix things before they have to be turned again.