Teenage Rebellion: Bad Parenting or "Just a phase?"

[Eudaimonic]

I've heard good arguments from both sides and my intuition says bad parenting, but I'd like to know if anyone has some really strong arguments for either side. I'd like to be a parent some day and if it is really just a phase, I'd like to be aware so that I can be supportive.

As well I think it would put my teenage years in a slightly better perspective.

Perhaps it's a combination?

I also realize that I put this in the wrong forum, my mistake...

[RamynKing]

While it is a natural phase: The child feels the need to throw the training wheels off. Or to express themselves.

I think we find ourselves, as a society, putting A TON of blame on this "phase" for a whole range of dysfunctional behavior. I'm still learning about it, but it seems like there's this idea from the Frankfurt School types, that says parents are bad, and that kids should "reinvent the wheel."

The real culprit is bad parenting.

Divorce plays a huge role, but it can be any situation where the child loses trust in their parents' ability to help them build a good life.

I can't imagine Stef's kid going out and vandalizing, or getting full sleeve tattoos, or even becoming an aggressive angsty music fan. That's not an argument per se, but I've seen the non-rebellious kids first hand as well.

I grew up from in a broken home, and shielded from the healthy kids in a way. I thought it was normal for one to have zero regard for their parents' ideas and lessons. I remember being really surprised when I saw other kids that had very loving relationships with their mothers, but were also not weaklings.

I think I could probably say a lot more. On a certain level, this topic is massively important to me.

[Drew.]

Yeah, this might be more suited for peaceful parenting, but eh, whatever.

Teens do go through an individuation process. They distance themselves from their primary family members, make greater associations with peers and people near to their age, they experiment, and they show a greater desire to be independent and not be aided by the parents. So, no matter how good or bad of a parent you are, you can expect this. That these baby birds are going to start trying to fly out of the nest and hunt worms for themselves. This experimentation might involve drugs, alcohol, etc. even with good parenting. There are no teens that I know of that I would consider to have really good parenting, so a lot of this is speculation and also based on developmental theories.

Rebellion in my mind has to do with acting out and being angry. There is resentment in rebellion. That, fuck you, you don't know what you're talking about. I think rebellion occurs as the teens come to realize how they have been mistreated and taken advantage of by parenting engaging in poor parenting practices. I think that good parenting can help mitigate rebellion, by allowing the child to be angry at the parents, validating the emotion, and earnestly listening to what the child has to share. Individuation cannot be avoided, and is a great and wonderful thing. It is the transition into full person- and adulthood.

[S1988]

Letting kids get angry at parents or voice their opinions are also good ways for them to stand up to others, even to authority figures. After all, being in charge doesn't mean you're always right.

When I was a kid, when I got angry with my mother, I was punished for my "bad attitude." As a result, it made me vulnerable to bullies because I didn't want to appear "mean," which got me scolded for not standing up for myself. Talk about a mixed message. You can't punish a child for showing anger or disagreeing with you, and then wonder why they struggle with standing up for themselves.

Now, it's a bit easier because I'm grown up, so no one can punish me for being "bad" anymore. I even stood up to my family, the ultimate bullies, by cutting them out. I continue to learn ways to defend myself, especially against those who think just because I'm quiet and keep to myself a lot, that I need some kind of "help."

[Garrett]

What would a child of a peaceful, loving parent have to rebel about?

Say a child starts on a path of self-destructive behavior, like drug dependence, or excessive piercing and tattooing. Is that not a sign of mental duress? Bad parenting.

How about bullying others or damaging property? Where did they learn that? From parents? Obvious bad parenting. From poorly chosen friends? Did the parents not teach a child how to choose good friends? Bad parenting.

 

That's not to say great parenting is easy. I had a boss once who would point out that all less-than-perfect outcomes are due to insufficient planning. No matter how impossible a situation seemed to be, there would always be something he could point out in hind sight that you could have done differently for a better outcome. He was infuriating, but infuriatingly correct. I would point out that one would need near omniscience to have been able to see such and such coming. Well, that still didn't change the fact that it was due to poor planning. On the other hand, he never really held much against me. The point was not to place blame and denigrate anyone. The point was to simply learn from the experience, no matter how small or narrow the lesson. So coming back to "bad parenting," well it's hard to blame parents for not being perfect, and I can't imagine even our hero Stef has parented perfectly. So what? If we are truly doing our best to know as much as we can about good parenting (not the lame excuse version of "I did my best"), and learning from our mistakes, all is as well as can be in our non-god-like state.

[RichardY]

I think anger is generally a constructive emotion, something is wrong I'd like to fix it. So teenage rebellion if it involves anger is fine. Contrasted with something like rage or resentment(Both more unconscious) can be be genocidal, as seen in all major conflicts and again in Europe.

[Jsbrads]

Children begin individuation at two when they say NO!  to everything. 

Obviously neglect can lead to very bad behavior. But I think that the nuclear family is a failed recent system. The extended family was the model that has lasted thru the ages.

i read an article of a dad saying how he has learned so much in the first 15 yrs raising his single child, a daughter. 

What about the grandparents? They are a wealth of information to assist with the raising of young. And when a teen is combative with his/her parents, a cooler head can calm things down. Grandparents were a great resource to the family, torn out of the family by Social Security in the US.

[Elizbaeth]

On 7/31/2017 at 2:26 PM, RamynKing said:

I grew up from in a broken home, and shielded from the healthy kids in a way. I thought it was normal for one to have zero regard for their parents' ideas and lessons. I remember being really surprised when I saw other kids that had very loving relationships with their mothers, but were also not weaklings.

I think I could probably say a lot more. On a certain level, this topic is massively important to me.

I remember seeing healthy kid-parent dynamics and feeling so sad and angry that I didn’t have that, too. It was a shock. I actually tried dating a guy who had happy parents and a great relationship with his grandparents and sister just to be around his family. 

I was pretty much the “perfect” child until my teenage years, and then shit hit the fan big time when I started questioning my mom. All questions were met with the attitude of me asking questions = me declaring I hated my mother and everything she sacrificed for me. Then she reacted with what I call “Operation Squelch The Interloper,” where her mission was to destroy this new emerging me and get back her “real” daughter. My only options were to fold or rebel. I have no doubt that teenage rebellion is due to bad parenting.

[barn]

Hi @Eudaimonic

All of my living real-life rolemodels have been people with a 'straight spine', had developed above average listening skills and solid, simple arguments about why they do what they do (and I don't mean empty justifications). Either for support or criticism, there was a steady and consistent style. I'm sure they had their flaws but when contrasting with their virtues it wasn't anything that constituted to much. I couldn't help but lean towards giving a second thought to their recommendations even if I wanted else. I just could never shake the sensation of their words coming from a 'genuine place' and me being in the phase that the adults called 'rebellious teenager years'.

Not all of them are intelligent or adept at interpersonal skills to the same level. Though I am certain all of them stand for something(their life has a meaning) and pursue things pro-actively, embracing bumps&hiccups.

(My parents and family... like night & day. I rebelled a lot against any and all at a certain age, then withdrew as the oppression got unbearable, until the day I waved good bye forever. It's one of my decisions that I'm truly proud of having made.)

Barnsley

[hewiestolarz]

Well, i was pretty rebellious as a teen, and I do remember why. It was because everyone constantly for a decade expected me to conform to their expectations, both in school and in home, while in the same time, no one showed any sign or interest whatsoever in changing their behavior based on my feedback. Like, i should respect their feedback, but when i attempt to provide feedback about how my parents' performan their role as parents or my teachers' perform their role as education providers, i would be punished and verbally abused in return. So resentment towards those people who provided me negative feedback without any respect of curiosity for my feedback began to build up. The relationship was completely one-sided in its nature, and I found that to be unjust to the core. And I felt angry and resentful and sad about the one-sided nature of the relationship, i felt it to be deeply unjust that they impose behavioral standards on me that they show no willingness to apply to themselves. So what happened is that when as a teen i realized that i am no longer small and no longer utterly dependent, and i gained the ability to actually express this built-up anger in a direct manner, I no longer needed to contain it all in myself. 

So my one-sided relationship with my parents merely became mutual and two-sided. The same way they rejected my criticisms  and my feedback about them and reacted to it with verbal abuse, I began to react to their feedback and criticism with verbal abuse aswell. It was really all about the patterns they were setting into motion. The only reason i was a ,,good child" before was that i was unable to confront them and also unable to leave them. But when i grew older, and I was finally able to do both of these, I did. 

If my parents would have been curious of my opinion and really had a desire to meet my needs, moreover, would have showed any willingness to modify their behavior based on my wishes and feedback, I would have done the same to them - even as a teen. But they didnt care about me, so I didin't care about them either.

[Jsbrads]

Statistically bad behavior is due to bad parenting, individuals still have free will.

85% of people in jail come from a single parent home. Raising children comes with a two part disclaimer: You will make mistakes as a parent and despite how few mistakes you make, your child has the free will to make bad choices.

[Drew.]

On 2/5/2018 at 6:57 AM, Jsbrads said:

Statistically bad behavior is due to bad parenting, individuals still have free will.

85% of people in jail come from a single parent home. Raising children comes with a two part disclaimer: You will make mistakes as a parent and despite how few mistakes you make, your child has the free will to make bad choices.

I would love to see where you got this data from.

I agree, all parents make mistakes. All parents harm their children. Better parents correct their mistakes, make less of them in general, and give their children the tools to fix themselves.