What am I failing to grasp?

[Jot]

I am currently in university and I feel stuck in this never-ending cycle of feeling moderately positive and then falling into feeling depressed and apathetic. 

It was not a sincere desire of mine to attend university, I hated high school and was constantly waiting for it to finish so I can feel like I am being myself. 

The real reason I chose to go to uni as well was to avoid the dreaded confrontation with my family members and I also had very little money as I do now.

What realizations do have I failed to make to get out of this mental slump?

[barn]

Hi @Jot

I hope to help you clarifying things. Well-intended, straightforward style.

You said..

1 hour ago, Jot said:

I am currently in university and I feel stuck in this never-ending cycle of feeling moderately positive and then falling into feeling depressed and apathetic. 

Would it be fair to say that it is a passive, 'having been made to do so' type of attitude you see yourself in the present?

While wanting to break free in the past..

1 hour ago, Jot said:

It was not a sincere desire of mine to attend university, I hated high school and was constantly waiting for it to finish so I can feel like I am being myself. 

You assessed, narrated your past actions as if you were running away from something?

... aaaand, if the previous two are part of a trend..

1 hour ago, Jot said:

The real reason I chose to go to uni as well was to avoid the dreaded confrontation with my family members and I also had very little money as I do now.

By choosing the current scenario (seemed the best at the time, as the path with the least resistance) you've been trying to circumvent using your unique set of abilities for your developing towards your true potential, standing up for what you really want and folding under pressure according to your own standards? (notice, I'm not blaming here. I try to make you realise what expectations you had/have.)

Think of this. People respond to incentives, their actions are their own. You're following, right?!

No living creature exists to self-sabotage or lives for the sake of unhappiness, failure. Sure, there are some in crises who act out desperation, but...

We do things because we choose them according to what we think it is going to be the most benefit to us. If you don't see yourself as one who made those decisions, you also loose the agency it required, the motivation and reasoning behind. You need those in order to assess and to make better decisions. Fuck mistakes. Happens all the time. What matters if you repeat them.

a., Were you coerced to go to Uni, or it was you who thought that's what you should be doing? And it doesn't matter if others were pushing but you had the final word, went for it, signed the papers, showed up to the test... etc.   (sorry for the rhetorical)

b., Again, think of this. Is it true to claim there's no cure for an illness because the patient took the most commonly available medicine?

Here's some questions to get you started :

 

1. Is it possible that there are a great many advantages in your current life that when compared to someone being 'out of a bubble' you are overlooking?

2. Could it be that you are wasteful with your opportunities and that makes you feel that you are under performing?

3. Have you assessed your near-future and mid-long / long-term goals in order to properly align your heading?

4. Are there changes you desire to enact but due to self-sabotage(not gathering enough info, actively testing out theories) there's an underlying distaste about your own conduct?

5. Have you investigated what those individuals had to invest into their success first, that you envy? Who do you envy? Why?

 

If you were really trying to get the best answers possible, I recommend doing Jordan B. Peterson's self authoring suite.

- it's dirt cheap, immensely helpful

- all that you discover you'll get to keep and not just utilise immediately but get to incorporate into your conscious development going forward.

Take action, either way. Stay in motion, dispell the mental fog, pal!

Barnsley

[Frederik]

On 12/29/2017 at 11:05 PM, Jot said:

I am currently in university and I feel stuck in this never-ending cycle of feeling moderately positive and then falling into feeling depressed and apathetic. 

It was not a sincere desire of mine to attend university, I hated high school and was constantly waiting for it to finish so I can feel like I am being myself. 

The real reason I chose to go to uni as well was to avoid the dreaded confrontation with my family members and I also had very little money as I do now.

What realizations do have I failed to make to get out of this mental slump?

Do you have someone in your life who listens to you empathetically? Maybe a therapist or a close friend?

[Jot]

2 hours ago, Fred Black Fox said:

Do you have someone in your life who listens to you empathetically? Maybe a therapist or a close friend?

No, I have no friends at all. Lately, I have been making efforts to get into therapy but since therapy is so expensive relative to my cash flow it will be a real struggle to find a way to make therapy a sustainable path. I guess 1 month or so would still be better than nothing though but I need to make sure I don't miss the right therapist.

[Jot]

On 12/30/2017 at 1:16 AM, barn said:

Would it be fair to say that it is a passive, 'having been made to do so' type of attitude you see yourself in the present?

No. I thought it was clear that I do not try to cast "the blame" on anyone else. That is why I approached this issue as "what am I..."

 

On 12/30/2017 at 1:16 AM, barn said:

You assessed, narrated your past actions as if you were running away from something?

... aaaand, if the previous two are part of a trend..

I am not sure I understood your point here, would you mind decrypting this?

On 12/30/2017 at 1:16 AM, barn said:

By choosing the current scenario (seemed the best at the time, as the path with the least resistance) you've been trying to circumvent using your unique set of abilities for your developing towards your true potential, standing up for what you really want and folding under pressure according to your own standards? (notice, I'm not blaming here. I try to make you realise what expectations you had/have.)

I did choose the current scenario. It never seemed "the best" but it was a way for me to avoid the anxiety and fear of that moment because they felt so overwhelming for me at that time.

On 12/30/2017 at 1:16 AM, barn said:

a., Were you coerced to go to Uni, or it was you who thought that's what you should be doing? And it doesn't matter if others were pushing but you had the final word, went for it, signed the papers, showed up to the test... etc.   (sorry for the rhetorical)

Neither. As I said, it was a way for me to avoid the whole stress of that time.

On 12/30/2017 at 1:16 AM, barn said:

b., Again, think of this. Is it true to claim there's no cure for an illness because the patient took the most commonly available medicine?

No, because that would be fallacious reasoning. Did I imply that I would believe this?

On 12/30/2017 at 1:16 AM, barn said:

1. Is it possible that there are a great many advantages in your current life that when compared to someone being 'out of a bubble' you are overlooking?

2. Could it be that you are wasteful with your opportunities and that makes you feel that you are under performing?

3. Have you assessed your near-future and mid-long / long-term goals in order to properly align your heading?

4. Are there changes you desire to enact but due to self-sabotage(not gathering enough info, actively testing out theories) there's an underlying distaste about your own conduct?

5. Have you investigated what those individuals had to invest into their success first, that you envy? Who do you envy? Why?

1. What do you mean by being out of a bubble?

2. I think I am wasteful with time. And lost time is lost opportunities, this is why I am trying to take as much action as I can to solve this.

3. I have been thinking about them lately but when I am in a depressed state they all look meaningless to me, it seems that I have to "wait" for the right "tide" to come to find meaning and motivation to pursue them but it does not last very long. This is my main issue.

4. As far as feeling depressed could be considered self-sabotage (which is something I think it very likely is) yes.

5. Those who I envy I do not admire.

[barn]

Hi @Jot

/An observation. I think you are very good at speaking your mind when you choose to./

(overall) Do you think I am assessing correctly that my comments were rather on the inconvenient side for you?

I'll try to clarify things further...

5 minutes ago, Jot said:

On 12/30/2017 at 12:16 AM, barn said:

Would it be fair to say that it is a passive, 'having been made to do so' type of attitude you see yourself in the present?

No. I thought it was clear that I do not try to cast "the blame" on anyone else. That is why I approached this issue as "what am I..."

I'm not saying I'm right. I draw my conclusions from...

On 12/29/2017 at 11:05 PM, Jot said:

I feel stuck

(being in a place you don't want to but can't move)

On 12/29/2017 at 11:05 PM, Jot said:

never-ending cycle of feeling moderately positive and then falling into

 (gravity is pulling, repetitive you aren't stopping it, just happens)

11 minutes ago, Jot said:

On 12/30/2017 at 12:16 AM, barn said:

You assessed, narrated your past actions as if you were running away from something?

... aaaand, if the previous two are part of a trend..

I am not sure I understood your point here, would you mind decrypting this?

Surely, sorry for not being concise.

When you wrote..

On 12/29/2017 at 11:05 PM, Jot said:

It was not a sincere desire of mine to attend university,

IF it wasn't what you wanted (partly my later coercion question), and you previously you'd been mainly motivated by...

On 12/29/2017 at 11:05 PM, Jot said:

I hated high school and was constantly waiting for it to finish so I can feel like I am being myself. 

Isn't it fair to assume (from what you'd shared) that whatever you were going through during those times you wished to see behind your back... as in 'trying to escape from'?

The next bit, I don't think you got what I meant, probably because I was too broad here, again... dunno. Lemme try.

20 minutes ago, Jot said:

I did choose the current scenario. It never seemed "<A>the best" but it was a way for me to <B> avoid the anxiety and fear of that moment because they felt so overwhelming for me at that time.

 <A> When I went for my laptop, I chose it in accordance with my budget and needs. The best laptop for me in the shop would have been much better but obviously I couldn't afford it. The cheapest laptop that was still somewhat applicable would have meant that I would have saved money but it wasn't going to be as good as I could 'afford',hence my final decision on maximising opportunity cost/budget in my investment. (3 months later burglars broke in and 'waz a goner with the wind', Dammit crack addicts!, bad parenting!...nor here nor there.)

So I had assumed that you made the same decision when choosing "the best", meaning you opted for what you sincerely thought was the maximum benefit from the 'budget' you were working with. I don't think you had self-sabotaged or willfully messed things up by choosing something you didn't want AT THE TIME.

 <B> When we avoid, we are fully seeing the obstacle. You don't avoid what you don't know that it exist. Right?! Maybe I'm wrong here?

If we see an obstacle, don't want to deal with it but still want to experience having solved it... we try circumventing, if we don't think we can cope with it. Do we not?! Again, maybe you work differently. I'm happy to be corrected.

42 minutes ago, Jot said:

On 12/30/2017 at 12:16 AM, barn said:

a., Were you coerced to go to Uni, or it was you who thought that's what you should be doing? And it doesn't matter if others were pushing but you had the final word, went for it, signed the papers, showed up to the test... etc.   (sorry for the rhetorical)

Neither. As I said, it was a way for me to avoid the whole stress of that time.

With the rhetorical mention, I was pointing at my previous assessment of 'running away from' assumption, because "avoid the whole stress" do sound to me like that. (again) I could have been wrong.

46 minutes ago, Jot said:

On 12/30/2017 at 12:16 AM, barn said:

b., Again, think of this. Is it true to claim there's no cure for an illness because the patient took the most commonly available medicine?

No, because that would be fallacious reasoning. Did I imply that I would believe this?

Good for you.

No, you technically haven't implied my examples conclusion, not at all.

I was going for the 'although you might not be feeling great at the place you brought yourself, it doesn't mean it isn't really good for you'.

Looking back on the flow, I don't think I had communicated that very efficiently.

I wasn't aiming to discuss them here, but sure, why not?... regarding the 'get you started questions'

.. next post...

 

[barn]

1 hour ago, Jot said:

1. Is it possible that there are a great many advantages in your current life that when compared to someone being 'out of a bubble' you are overlooking?

->

1 hour ago, Jot said:

1. What do you mean by being out of a bubble?

Not studying (out) vs studying, usually at a younger age with help from parents / government / both but most importantly within the mechanics of academic life (in).

I was looking for Jordan B. Peterson's way of characterisation but for the life of me I couldn't find it... if anyone can, I'd appreciate that.

1 hour ago, Jot said:

2. Could it be that you are wasteful with your opportunities and that makes you feel that you are under performing?

->

1 hour ago, Jot said:

2. I think I am wasteful with time. And lost time is lost opportunities, this is why I am trying to take as much action as I can to solve this.

That's great, MORE POWER TO YOU.

1 hour ago, Jot said:

3. Have you assessed your near-future and mid-long / long-term goals in order to properly align your heading?

->

1 hour ago, Jot said:

3. I have been thinking about them lately but when I am in a depressed state they all look meaningless to me, it seems that I have to "wait" for the right "tide" to come to find meaning and motivation to pursue them but it does not last very long. This is my main issue.

In my opinion, what had worked for me is this.

Ffff-uck it!

Just keep going. It's all-right, seriously.

If I'm depressed, or low energy all that means that I will go slower, continue inching like a snail. I empathise with my state and needs, so when I have beaten my self up I'll first tend my wounds and make crutches to be able to limp forward. Forward, forward, forward, fuck the speed or the distance I make. It's my current best I can do. So I'm doing it. The whole point is movement, not the speed. Sure, I'll eventually recover but certainly I can watch the right videos, make phone calls, review my progress, clean up stuff, prepare a delicious meal... etc.

1 hour ago, Jot said:

4. Are there changes you desire to enact but due to self-sabotage(not gathering enough info, actively testing out theories) there's an underlying distaste about your own conduct?

->

1 hour ago, Jot said:

4. As far as feeling depressed could be considered self-sabotage (which is something I think it very likely is) yes.

No. That's imho is a false conclusion. Depression is a result. It stems from a source, IT'S WHAT IS BEFORE that is the culprit.

Now, not helping yourself to get better is different. That, pal IS self-sabotage. (if you don't help yourself... I can't tell. Are you?)

1 hour ago, Jot said:

5. Those who I envy I do not admire.

->before I responded, I would like to ask you to give a definition of what's envy(1) and who do you envy and why(2). I can't otherwise respond with much connectivity unless... (me thinks)

Also : How's the convo for you?

[villagewisdom]

1. Decide who you want to be.

2. Make it so. 

[eschiedler]

The more you pursue happiness, the more you will suffer. All wise philosopher men throughout history would agree on this point. Now if you pursue only truth itself, you will be free in your mind.

[barn]

{meanwhile}

Another great thing has occurred to me the other day, and it's about 'doing inventory'. (Seeing who you are for what you are...not what you think you were) = As to me, that's exactly what a foundation IS when looking into self-knowledge.

There's a great amount of different sites and resources claiming to give insight on your 5 big personality traits. As someone who's been fairly obsessed with such topics, allow me to give a friendly advice and recommend; just go straightforward to Understand myself by Jordan B Peterson.

I'm in no way affiliated or benefit from if you do take it, other than a slight boost to my pride(did something good again) and a small blip of empathetic joy for your success(you'll learn stuff that is cornerstone-brevity important, I gua-ran-tee that!).

You'll learn about your levels of

& at the same time

be able to compare to others, see what's good/bad about it and why(huge pool, scientifically established... I mean by real scientists. NOT 'Colgate 9/10 dentists..' joke.)

& also

everything is in plain English, relatable connections explained regarding:

Agreeableness: Compassion and  
Politeness

Conscientiousness: Industriousness and  Orderliness

Extraversion: Enthusiasm and  
Assertiveness

Neuroticism: Withdrawal and Volatility

Openness to Experience: Openness and Intellect

Given also, that currently you have less people in your support groups, mainly work on your own, budgetwise prefer the modest...

I personally (who has taken it and my mind is still 'click', 'click'.. keeps clicking by the sheer connections that get revealed continously ) think you would immensely benefit getting simple but powerful personalised answers. Seriously, you won't find anything better currently.

 

 

[RichardY]

@Jot

1) What are you studying?
2) If you get the degree does it allow much easier emigration to other countries? Is this something that could make it worthwhile for you?
3) Do you enjoy the course?
4) Could you change to another university course etc
5) Do I need the degree to do what I am studying? 
6) If SHTF do you have a backup plan?
7) Personality and self knowledge are very important, record what you do in a commonplace book.

NOTE: I may not reply if you comment, for a week +. Hoboing/backpacking  around Basel then Spain on the 8th. So I guess perhaps take what I say with a pinch of salt.    

[lorry]

On 12/29/2017 at 10:05 PM, Jot said:

I am currently in university and I feel stuck in this never-ending cycle of feeling moderately positive and then falling into feeling depressed and apathetic. 

It was not a sincere desire of mine to attend university, I hated high school and was constantly waiting for it to finish so I can feel like I am being myself. 

The real reason I chose to go to uni as well was to avoid the dreaded confrontation with my family members and I also had very little money as I do now.

What realizations do have I failed to make to get out of this mental slump?

 

The realization you have failed to make attempted to avoid, is that you are a coward. You don't have to be, but so long as you choose to act so, you are a coward.

[Jsbrads]

I recall hearing Dr. Peterson describing the need for a goal. That striving for something valuable that makes life worth living. I myself struggle for the same, my situation not being what I want despite attempts to get out.

Still at uni? Perhaps they have counseling there. 

[Mole]

Don't take this as an excuse to stop thinking, but do what ever you feel  like doing, literally! Emotions reflect beliefs. If you don't feel like being in university, then take a break! (that's what I'm doing). Don't feel like doing something? Then why do it? If you don't feel like being in university, it means for some reason you believe you shouldn't be there at the moment.

[Jsbrads]

I have also availed myself to low cost counseling outside of uni, and recently began mindful meditation which I found very helpful to level out the bumps.