Tyler H

I don't understand; how could anything or anyone be inconsistent with what it or he is? Regardless, you've just defined justice as God. If God is justice, how do we know that? Coke is it. What is "it"? Coke. It's a meaningless tautology. So holiness is perfect morality? What is morality? We must have a standard in order to ensure He meets it right?

It's important to make the distinction, because a nation is not a thing making decisions, creating property, or acting on reality - individual people are doing that. People use concepts to shift the consequences of their actions to abstractions in order to escape said consequences.

Correct. The individual people exist; the concept family, which describes the relationship the individuals have with each other, does not exist. That example is comprised of people making decisions with their own property and agreements with regard to each others actions with said property - the concept owns nothing. I'm pretty sure that wouldn't be embezzlement anyway, but regardless embezzlement is not reality, that's another concept describing actions and decisions made by people. If you can't distinguish the difference between things that exist in reality and concepts then I'm not sure how we can continue this discussion.

Welcome Mr. M.O.M.

Could you define justice and holiness for me please?

Thanks @shirgall. Sorry, I just saw I hadn’t responded to this.

There are plenty of justifications to take the job, the state doesn’t leave us much choice in the world. This is a personal decision that I think, for whatever that’s worth, you should make based upon what you expect your conscience will let you live with. It sounds like you would not feel comfortable if something you did increased the psychological ease with which someone else could murder or the death count they would generate. We know there are quite a bit of civilian casualties. I think from what you’ve said if you had any other option you would prefer that; have you exhausted every other possibility?

Oh, so he’s a sadist who likes to show off then? He created sentient beings in order to make them suffer, and this displays justice and holiness?

Formation is not a term that only relates to physical, tangible existence. Ideas are formed, conclusions are formed, friendships are formed- all abstract concepts. Second, I don’t know where you are getting that I said something that exists requires individual actors or requires direction, a rock has neither of those properties. Defining existence as material (and I would add the space between) is only contradictory if you include the first two statements, which I wouldn’t. I know a nation has the first two properties, and not the third. Kind of the point. Forget the semantics. There is a difference between that which is material and that which is conceptual. That’s the distinction I’m pointing out.

Ok, what is your understanding of my definition?

What is your definition of existence?

Who said anything about impossibility? I'm talking about things that exist in reality, things that occupy physical space. Numbers, the scientific method, mathematical equations; all these abstract concepts have requirements, yet do not exist in material space. Supports my position, not yours. Remove the individual actors and the abstract concept has no ability to claim or exercise ownership, because it does not exist, proving the individual actors are ones exercising their ownership.

Uh, no. The nation is a title, the individuals claim and exercise ownership. You conveniently disregarded addressing the point that a nation doesn't exist, and therefore can't own anything. I'll concede that point. However, it would be the exception not the rule.

But there is unlimited demand for money isn’t there? The demand for tickets is set by what the ticket allows access to and how many people desire that access. It seems like you’re comparing apples and oranges.

So how could we make women property if they own themselves?