FriendlyHacker

Giving food to a homeless person is stealing? If that happens in rich countries, where people below poverty are richer than the mid class in 3rd world countries, what would happen to the poor on those places? Is easy to say people are lazy and don't want to make a living, when you live in one of the richest places in the world, with one of the best educational system in the world, I've noticed people have a warped idea of what it really means to be poor, and they usually have no idea what it means to live in a place riddled with structural violence, specially if they live in Canada, one the least violent places in the world.

Do you know how that works out on, say McDonald's? I've saw a news article saying McDonald's staff will get fired for giving food away, no idea if that is true though. Here in Brazil, is actually a legal liability to give food away, if anyone gets sick from your free food, you can be sued for it, companies would be too afraid to do it even if they were willing to.

You can only make a buck from something scarce enough that people will to pay for it. If it starts raining gold, people won't give a shit about gold and scrap all their jewelry. If everyone had access to food, you could not sell food, if everyone had access to housing, you could not sell housing, if everyone had access to basic human rights, there would be no human rights activists. Is it possible to defend human rights, and then start talking about people having to pay for their right to live? If you say money is necessary to control consumption and waste, that is clearly not working. And if you want to use money to control access to resources, use the occam's razor and realize you don't need money at all, if you want to control resources, have your economic system to be based on saving resources and not in made up paper.

Don't be so sure about scarcity being necessary. I've never seen any official report coming out of The Venus Project advocating any kind of violence. Get rid of structural violence, and you might find there won't even be much violence left to be dealt with. Have you ever seen how starving animals behave? Get some food to two starving animals, and they will kill each other for the scraps, make sure they are always well fed and taken care of, and they will display friendly behavior. We are fighting for scraps here, hence we see each other as the enemy and create wars as a failed attempt to suppress violence. There's only a policeman in front of something people need and have no access to. Have you noticed though that while we fight for scraps, the restaurant across the street is trashing the food they could not sell? And is refusing to give it away, because free food means they are out of the food selling business?

Also, would like to point out that Microsoft had the surface tablet about 10 years before Apple had the iPad, though it was the size of a dining room table and cost as much as a car. And ever wondered how touch screens actually work? You might find is directly related to peering at sparkly useless things nobody gives a shit about and won't part a penny for.

"Most of this is happening because public funding for astronomy and space travel has declined significantly. Without any public interference, things would continue in the areas where they can get private backers." Most of this happening because the hardcore investment was done by NASA 50 years ago, and now is a matter of adapting available technology, which is basically the way every consumer product is done, first Experimental Physicists and cosmologists figure out how X-Ray works, or if that is even a thing, build huge X-Ray machines, die from the radiation, and then the Hospital technology companies take advantage of subsequent miniaturization and sell the same technology for a fraction of the price. When financial losses of figuring out how things work are taken, when all the mistakes are already done and people have died, is easy for the market to actually try selling it. Though I don't see the Nuclear Technology companies thanking Marie Curie for putting her life on the line and getting cancer, some people enjoy taking credit for the actual work.

Really? Are you comparing traveling around the world collecting animals, making drawings or arranging a few pieces of glass and wood in the shape of a tube, with something like space age technology? Can you really not tell the difference? Steve Jobs never invented anything, he was a very smart snake oil marketing guy that got rich and famous on work other people did, because he knew how to pack available technology in a nice and easy to use box.

Zeitgeister? Have affiliation with neither the Zeitgeist movement or Peter Joseph. I'm a volunteer over The Venus Project. Nothing I say here represents the views of The Venus Project, and whatever TVP says also do not automatically represent my views. One thing is saying all Physics is resulted from work done by Galileo and Kepler, a very different one is saying that the exact technology you have on your computer and telecom system, was funded by the government under real military intent. I could explain how each one of those pieces was created, if I have the time I might do it, but don't think I was well enough received here to be that generous.

Thanks, fixed it.

You want to be a good philosopher? Start questioning everything and don't follow anyone. Sheep follow shepherds and always end up doing what the master wants, be your own man and think for yourself. And then you can tell me how quoting someone word by word is slander.

Link to 54 minutes into the video "The other thing too, I mean all of these scientists, I mean what do they do? They suck at the government tit all the time, I mean this is one of the great tragedies of WWII, is that it turned engineering into academic science, and so I mean you got this complete bullshit peer review system which is all political and you know they did this study recently where they tried to replicate the 56 biggest findings in cancer research, and could replicate like 6 of them, that's like 10%, 90% of this shit went unchallenged, 80 thousand patients went to trials for bullshit and probably died, this shit get people killed, and people say: - Well, this person has not been peer reviewed. Peer review is just... you know what peer review is in a rational society? It's the customer fucking parting money for something, that's peer review, I don't need peer review on an iPad, I just need to know if I am going to buy it or not, and same thing is true about Apple, the peer review is because nobody gives a shit about what you are doing, and won't part with a god dammed penny for it, and so you got to submit to some other process to get your grants and suck off the blood of the tax payer even more you god dammed scientists! And so you invent this process called peer review because there is no fucking market for what you're doing, cause you are a bunch of parasites diddling around with your big telescopes and making pretty pictures, sell them to me! Put them in a fucking calendar! I don't care, ride them like Miley Syrus rides a wrecking ball, id like to see Neil deGrasse Tyson that, but that's just a little aside, but you know, take your big cock and point at the money market, I mean that'd be great! Fantastic, you know shake your money belt in a leopard skin, I don't care, but go sell something in the fucking marketplace and stop taking my money for your hobbies! 99% of science these days are a fucking hobby! (Neil deGrasse Impression) - I like stars! I think moons are pretty! So I would really like a giant telescope for 2 trillion dollars so I can point it to a nebula and say: Uhhh, that's sparkly! Good God people! Don't take my money because you like looking at sparkly things! Jesus, I mean, are you Marilyn Monroe? I's a hobby! People have telescopes on the park it's a hobby! Go make something that people want and that is useful! Like a medicine that you can sell to people! But this giant super collider, bady blady blah is like, oh my God, I mean, leave my child future alone, and go play with a "meccanos??" set like you're supposed to! [.....] [....]Don't get me wrong, I love the methodology of science and all that, but the purpose of knowledge is to satisfy demand! I mean, maybe a charity of people would give their stuff so geeky guys could peer at telescopes at things that don't matter. Before the second world war, there literally were only a few hundred thousand scientists in the whole world, the whole world! There were only a few hundred thousand scientists, and in the war, they got all these scientists and diverted them from industry and and technology or whatever, where they were actually producing stuff that consumers wanted, that made the world richer and better, they diverted all of this stuff to the military industrial complex, and now the military industrial complex and academia, coff coff, that word leaves a bad taste in my mouth, tastes like fascism, but academia and the military industrial complex employed the vast majority of scientist, and now there are 7 million scientists in the world? That's like piling 9 thousand hookers on a street corner, I mean nobody could even untangle them, let alone use them for any functional thing, so I mean, it's ridiculous that it's all just a big bloated statist mess, so what they do is that they continually keep creating alarms, so they can get more money! - Global warming! And now I've just read, there's a giant asteroid coming to hit us in 2034! So is just this continuous panic that we need to invent, because there is no market demand, so all what they are doing is that they are creating such a vast amount of information, that nobody could sit through at all, there is no money, and no career to be made in debunking the bullshit that comes out of these research labs, you can look up the economist just a huge amount of this stuff is not replicable, is complete bullshit, and is just used to get published." So you heard it straight from the horse's mouth, he can't understand it because has no time to sit through all the hard to understand information, even though he talks like an expert on global warming, astronomy, cosmology, asteroid detection and particle physics, since he apparently is capable to understand it enough to call it bullshit. I heard Stefan say on another recent video though, that you have to be a good Physicist to even understand what a physicist is doing and comment on it, so he can go ahead and follow his own advice.

If proving a proposition, means I will have to teach astronomy and cosmology to people here so they can even tell what I'm talking about, I don't see that as efficient use of my time, as I said, there are books out there. But what you want me to prove anyway? That lasers were discovered because of atom smashers? Would you understand me if I did? You want me to show how lasers are used in almost every electronic equipment nowadays? What? I will get back to the video and show specifically when Stefan mentioned those things, just a bit busy right now.

Have you actually watched that video? He was saying the work these people do are a waste of time, since the free market does the hard science anyway, and they are there only to waste our money on their personal preferences. Obviously I don't support it. I am trying to make that world, could have a cushy job at CERN if I wanted to, and would be more useful that way, sometimes I do regret this decision though, because I either become rich like Darwin to fund my own projects (meaning I will create a corporation), or I will work at government funded places. I honestly don't know what is the worst option there.

I have mentioned many things already, but will mention one more: He was criticizing Astronomy/Cosmology, while using satellite communication technology, I rest my case. If I remember correctly, Stefan likes to boast how the Free Market is the one doing the hard science, being his most common example the Apple products, which are just a bundle of things coming out of government funded projects, that were put together on the same device and re-branded as Apple. Also, the one who brought this up on this topic was Kevin, so I was not replying neither to you or Stefan regarding that. I'm not here to defend any government, I'm as much of an anarchist as you are, I simply don't buy into the Free Market ideas and want to live in a world free of price tags.

Project Manhattan and its German counterpart funded all early advancements in particles physics engineering that gave us computer chips, lasers, semi-conductors, advanced ceramics, and etc... The UK Government funded research done by Alan Turing on devising the Turing machine (aka the machine we call a computer nowadays), Turing was the one who devised a machine that could automatically break the German Enigma Code. The Military Industrial Complex is, by far, the largest investor in Artificial Intelligence development. The military is also pushing forward the development of faster computers and data storage, faster computers means more control over the population, and better ways to encrypt/decrypt messages. GPS was created with military aircraft in mind, and was put into practice by artificial satellites, which in turn are only there because of NASA and Soviet funding in space exploration during the cold War. The Internet used to be a safe way for the military to send information to spies abroad. I could go and on, but if you want to know more about this, you will have to do some of your own research and read some books, this is not the place for me to make a book long reply, and neither I have the time. Ok, before criticizing what people do at CERN, or in biology research, you need to understand what they are doing. These kinds of jobs are the kind of thing that if done well enough, you don't even notice it was there. I would not be surprised to hear that people nagged Darwin and Mendel in their biology extravaganzas, when Darwin could have used his private fortune in other ways, such as charity or buying his wife and kids something they thought was useful. People want the results, but don't want to pay for the process. And the biggest issue with cutting edge science on the Free Market, is that cutting edge science almost never works, you can't know beforehand if this new meta-material will be the new graphene or something completely useless. Science wins even when it finds out that something won't work, that's not how the free market operates. If your product does not work, you close down your factory, fire all your employees and hope the banks won't own your very Soul from that point on. Science is a positive sum game, the free market is a zero sum game, they are fundamentally incompatible.

Are you one of those people who only do the things that need to be done on the last minute? Would you bet the life of every human being on the planet on such strategy? Try coming up with complex Asteroid intervention technologies, when the asteroid is visible to the human eye and a few hours from impact. Also, could you show me how the Free Market would profit, from an asteroid intervention that can save the life of everyone? If you want to do something good for humanity, a good start is not involving any money in it. Humans are the only animal who pay to live on the planet. Would we have to pay to save the planet too?

Somewhere in our local Galaxy, a whole Star system was just devoured by a black hole. A few years ago, 12 Dino killing sized asteroids hit Jupiter, simultaneously. Google Shoemaker. Neil deGrasse joked that if there is life in Jupiter, certainly there are no dinosaurs to be found now.

Think Free"The most amazing thing happened to me today. Absolutely nothing!" Richard Feynman The funny thing about that, is that the planet is large enough, the Universe is large enough, that crazy impossible things happen all the time.

Did you ever bet on the lottery? Have you ever played on a casino machine or video game and expected a jackpot? Because a lot of people believe things that are a thousand times less likely to happen than that asteroid hitting us, which is a cyclical process anyway, even if it won't happen in 20 years, it is bound to happen at some point.

darkskyabove : Am not saying is a justification for anything, don't try distorting what I have said, but go ahead, show me how the Free Market solves this. By the way, I am in need of some large funding to advance technologies and don't want to/scared off working for the government, do you have a solution for me? Read about it, am not getting back to this. Read the history of computers, the Internet, GPS, particle physics, etc... Did you know Alan Turing worked for the UK government during the war? That he invented modern computers? Did you know that the Internet was a communications system used in war? I could go on and on, read about it.

All modern technology has a single origin, the Military Industrial Complex. But don't believe me, read about it.

Kevin Beal: You are working with the technologies mentioned above, right now, else you would be sending me this from smoke signals. Hey you know why these technologies use governmental funding? Because you can't profit from them, it's not profitable to build a 50 billion dollar atom smasher, companies would not invest on that. Even though the technology coming out of that huge financial loss, is actually what moves our economy. Am not defending the government either, I am saying that the Free Market has not provided a solution to the huge investment required to move technology to new frontiers. And am making a clear point here, that those scientists are not useless, and that attacking their professions when you depend on those very things, is just silly. Hypothetical? There is a continent killing asteroid coming our way, the EMP disaster already happened, many times, we just didn't have electronics. And are you a global warming denier? Google it.

Telescopes are a hobby, though can predict civilization ending asteroid collisions, can be used to discover about global warming in other planets (and then find out it also happens here). The Sun and Supernovas are fancy things, until we are hit face on by Gamma Ray radiation and die, or a huge EMP destroys all our electronics. Atom smashers are a hobby, except all modern technology is based on the understanding of the inner workings of atoms, from computer chips, to lasers, to GPS and the Internet. So you see, our life depends on those very hobbies you question the legitimacy of.It is ok to say you don't understand what these people are doing, no need to attack their profession out of ignorance.