marius

I had a bad experience with the second therapist now. I will describe it chronologically, so that other people may find it easier to get away from harmful people disguised as medical professionals. The "" quotes mean what she said. ------------ Unable to give a definition of success Unable to draw an approximate a plan of what this interaction will be like, purpose, method, etc. Taking a defensive position when i come with some knowledge in psychology -didnt recommend to read the book on Schema, as she does to others - discussion seen as challenge to her dogma. -weird glance when i showed i carried a journal No homework Attack if asked to describe the stance on religion. "That's none of your business" Push to get along with people even though it doesnt depend all on me "Self-Aggrandizer" - in no way should i be proud of what i achieved. "Flow with the current, its easier". Dont rise your head above others. "Get a job", "Learn the local language" - Not advice or suggestion but directions. No regard for my reasons against (my parents fund me, im studying; would be loss of time; im not staying for much longer) -and when i responded that i dont agree with that, "Oh then dont do it" - as if nothing happened, no reasoning, just emotional responses When a disagreement is reached, she moves fast so that we dont solve or overcome it, i need to stop the discussion to address it. When i dont understand her message: "Of course you dont undertand" - well if shes so smart, why didnt she formulate it differently in the first place. How can you have productive communication with such a person. Inability to accept inconsistencies or mistakes when proven wrong. "You are making a religion out of logic" - No comment Insults: "nerd" ; "autistic" (not medical meaning, but insult); "that's just stupid" - after i answered that i want to do what i decide with my life. No wonder i felt uneasy during the process, no similarity to a special experience stef was talking about. I had to force myself to talk, nothing was coming out by itself. Contradictions: "you never asked me to define 'success' " - i did because thats on my list of first questions ; "never asked me to define 'health' " - but i did because it came up during one of the tests; "i never said 'go with the flow' " - but she did. -------------- This is a singular case, but lessons can be learned from it: dont start a difficult journey if you dont have any plan, dont accept insults, listen to your instinct about the person (may be difficult for people, because the reason they go into therapy in the first place is that they have emotional problems, so not calibrated). try to disqualify a person for the job instead of qualifying (the second should happen automatically as a result of the first) If you dont feel at home with the person, why lose time to overcome multiple levels of barriers, they are there for a purpose (again, this applies to less serious cases of trauma, when you still have the ability to judge people approx. objectively) The way disagreements and mistakes are dealt with Common values etc It took me 4 sessions to make the decision (due to multiple distractions), i hope it doesnt for you. Now im feeling a lot better, and im better at judging people.

I appreciate the response. I find it valuable that schema looks into the past so that you understand your patterns and the background. And of course by understanding and knowing them you have the chance to modify them. Its interesting that the therapist herself advised me against reading the main book on Schema. So advising against knowledge. That among other things led me to end the sessions. Damn hard to find a good one. (2 failed attempts) I imagine you arent going to have an easier time in France. (high formal authority level country)

While i cant say that i have talked to a representative sample of the population (Netherlands in this case), from what i heard from you guys and in general from other sources, its indeed a problem. The point regarding North America and freedom is relevant here, because the people that didnt leave Europe for The new world arent very interested in progress. And if you take the example of guns, its clear that this is a consequence of the leadership style for the last hundreds of years. You would think that people that are in a larger number raised without violence would embrace freedom, but looks like there is a conflict of interest, and moreover no violence doesnt mean healthy upbringing, i saw some examples that led to neglect. This, and add the fact that the economical and political system is unsustainable, i dont see myself hanging around here for much longer. I finish my Bachelors course and im gone. I dont feel any responsibility to prove anything to these people. Of course children are a different matter, which is why one of my plans is to make a system related to education, maybe even educating the parents.

Hello again,I had an intake with a therapist specialized in Schema Therapy & RET. She says that the RET does not suffice for people who had childhood trauma, which i think is correct. She has a not so friendly view on psychoanalysis and dream analysis, which is not a problem. Also i dont like that she avoided my question with religion. Ill have to insist. And she avoided giving me an outline (defining success, length, milestones, measuring at the beginning and end) -- will have to insist. She does appear to have experience, being a clinical psychologist. I just not so sure about the idea of re-parenting (schema -- even though i didnt read any advanced content). What has lacked at the time left effects that may be corrected, but whats done is done.

If the bitcoin news isnt waking people up to the opportunities of the internet and technology, i dont know what will...I still have a lot to learn about bitcoin.Dumitru, where are you from?

When you are looking in the past, that is not what the scientific method is about. That is known as method of agreement; retrospective study. It is good for finding correlations, but that alone is not science. For proof, it can't prove causality because you dont have an isolated variable that being the only difference must be responsible for the outcome effect. Regarding the success rate, i did not dig deep to find the results, but i must admit that i was interested. The studies are always a problem. How do you account for long term effects? How do you know that the process was not affected by a certain party? I dont even have the chance to choose a psycho-dynamic therapist.But again, i am not qualified to say what is good and what works, i will be able to share my experience after some months.

Thanks for answering finally. Be careful with analogies. I try to use first principles rather than analogies. There are two problems with looking extensively in the past: There are a lot of possible associations, and none of them scientific because it cant be replicated. (reminds me of dream analysis) And the second is that it takes a lot of time and resources without a clear return. For more on this you might want to see the success rate of Psychodynamic methods. I definitely agree with the objective of self knowledge that it makes you think more clearly, by knowing what kind of distortions you have in your head. (e.g. relationship to the state and relationship to the family) As i said, i am far from making a concrete statement on the matter. At the moment i am doing history and thinking, emotion analysis; but im staying far from IFS for the reasons i mentioned. Also you may find interesting another book with the same Author and main idea: Therapy Breakthrough. I havent read it yet.

Its too early to say for me, so far i like the focus on action. Im a beginner in this field, my only experience being with what Branden worked on. I see similarities between the 2 explanations of emotions: Value judgement given by Branden; ABC from REBT. And it is confirmed by my introspection, experience. The topic of resistance towards therapy was interesting to me. Giving part of the responsibility for my well being towards the therapist was risky (all or none -- failed concept), it gave bad results. Now i took matters into my own hands (with unprecedented results) but im still planning for a therapist in the near future.Today i read and processed the first ~40 pages of his book "Overcoming resistance". A bi unclear on the concepts of emotions being overlapped with behaviour and thinking, but overall helpful i would say. Definitely recommended.

It is nice to see that will power has its place clearly specified; and it was helpful because im doing research on that therapy method. Acting is crucial, but only after problem analysis.

thats a helpful post, thanks. do you have experience with CBT/REBT and how it compares for long term effects with psychodynamic (child focus, dream analysis)?

I had problems with extreme anxiety, and in the last 2 days i havent felt any of it. I reached a point when it truly wasnt acceptable anymore. The point is that i committed to not attacking myself, not letting impulses alone drive my actions. Its amazing what thinking -- and committing to it -- can do. Now i have this moments when i expect anxiety to kick in, and nothing happens... The refusal to stand against one-self. I was also thinking these days that when you are fighting with yourself, you dont stand a chance to win battles in the real world. TPTB see you as no threat. Debates are one thing, attack is another. What does the message say? I am no expert, but modern CBT will contradict you. The problem is in the thinking and behaviour mechanism created by that kind of events. The mechanism can be disassembled by first understanding its details, the understanding can come from past analysis ( more data, but difficult to analyze) or current events (subjective, but easy to recall)I asked some questions about this topic lately on fdr and didnt get a reply yet.Before giving this kind of advice, i say mention that you cant be sure. Even stef says this could endanger the person you are trying to help.

For the original question, i would recommend The psychology of self esteem. It made me think again about the importance of rationality, values, what you choose to think, emotions. To the IFS connoisseur's, I am interested on how you might reconcile "IFS" with "Three Minute Therapy" or other CBT based therapy practices. Am i the only one seeing a contradiction between what is talked about on the show and the recent guest stef had: Dr. Edelstein?

Recently i re-watched the interview with Dr. Edelstein I took a look at his book "Therapy Breakthrough: Why Some Psychotherapies Work Better Than Others" You can see the sample on amazon. Even in the first pages you can see the difference between "Old"(Psychodynamic) vs "New"(CBT) Therapy. In short the "new", some crucial things that are part of the self-knowledge understanding here on FDR as "old" (childhood experience, IFS) are said to be irrelevant to getting better. From what i see now its mostly based on your current way of thinking as being the thing that needs a change. It sounds reasonable, but what do you think about the differences? I just started to incorporate what Branden's concepts are, which seemed to help. 1. understand the cause of the behavior 2. extract general principle 3. incorporate it into future behavior Branden is not specifically in opposition to what Edelstein's ideas say.

Hi Ruben, Yes i got redirected to a person inside the same medical center SGE. I will certainly check it out. I am not really a local in the full sense, im a foreign student.Anyway, this reminds me of meetup groups, i checked the fdr community some time ago, and i did not see any Dutch cities. Really there arent any? Something has to be done.

(Updated 14-Dec-2013, see last post ) (Updated 29-Jan-2014, may help you) Hello Philosophers, ill keep it short. Today i had my first therapy hour. Not exactly what i expected. These are the characteristics: Good Homework sometimes given Supported my plan to do activities were i might improve my social life (hobbies, etc.) Participates, not only asks "how do you feel?" Asked about friends with which i could talk honestly (have a 1-2) Interested in what i study and how i got here (parents influence, etc) Placed more attention on parenting rather than school collective and experience. Bad Psychologist, not psychotherapist. Behavioral Therapy Focused 4-5 Sessions to fix my "Anxiety, Dread" problem. Coincides with usual insurance count limit. Introduced himself in a formal way without giving relevant personal information. (talked about the places he works) I had to unload my hypotheses about the history causes. Little questions from him. More focused toward acting as an adviser on action, social worker. More concerned with doing stuff you fear rather than pursuing the cause Correct me if im wrong, but this is a problem that is solved by correcting thinking,not? Did not get the impression that he puts value on emotions I did not feel amazed after finishing the session. Conclusion: I did not have the chance to ask most of my questions, but i think its clear anyways. So seeing that i dont have time, money to loose, my mind is almost entirely made up that i am looking for a new therapist on internet, will ask for the recent therapist's referral. I want a therapist that puts value on fixing the problem at its cause, not covering the symptoms. Questions: If anyone knows anything at all about the possibilities here, please let me know. (Im in the Netherlands, Eindhoven) If you think i interpreted something in a wrong way, please comment.

Thanks ill take a look

Im looking for a guide on journaling. the problem is that i have some ideas which are difficult to analyze in simply chronological order. say you have a problem, and you want to list multiple possible explanations, so you make a separate chapter where the organization is based on problems not dates. you want to find contradictions and paradoxes in your thinking, so you make a chapter for that tags? what system do you use to link ideas together? do you have a task list chapter to observe the progress? Can anyone share their experience regarding these more complex points or show me somewhere to look. Much obliged.

just letting you know that someone read what you posted lol. btw the link doest work, no worries though, i can search im documenting myself regarding psychotherapy, in special in the netherlands, as im studying here.

Hi again,I still have to figure out some things about my insurance, i am not a dutch citizen.thanks for the information

Now they will need therapyHow is psychotherapy in netherlands, is it all private? do you know of any 'good' ones? I have found websites with credentials about therapists, but not much else. Sorry for offtopic

the biggest hmmm i have is that they had connections with gov agencies before. text book set up. drills again, and anyway, who believes the official story?

Hi Philosophers, Ever since I was young, I found logics, probability andmaths easy to understand, almost instinctive, but I don’t like how it all comestogether for bigger problems. Attempt at describing the problem: Often times cant think of an answer at the required time. For example: Q: “What don’t you like about religion?” Often i will answer in a good enough way, but sometimes it doesnt match my own standards. I’m studying engineering in first year, so I feel thisproblem is disappearing, but I want to speed it up and make sure its goingwell. The question is where should I start so that I think moreclearly? I heard Stefan’s speech in NYC, and I started thinking thatI have this problem about organization of thoughts. I have some books on Logic: Critical Thinking = Bassham I Irwin I Nardone I Wallace Understanding Arguments = Walter Sinnott-Armstrong : DartmouthCollege & Robert J. Fogelin : Dartmouth College I know approximately what they contain, and I plan to readthem more in detail. If you have any suggestions please add them. To use figurative speaking which often helps: I want tobuild shelves and automatic ladders in my brain. I feel I can’t communicate convincingly if my own mind isnot ordered. I’m trying to bring structure to my thoughts, im gettingfrustrated often times in arguments with certain people, they are at fault forsure, but I should be in control and have an answer anyway. Im also working at self knowledge, which this is part of.

Those are good examples, but its not so open and obvious for everyone. Its difficult to get out of patriotism propaganda or to have basic economics skills. However basic physics or little investigative work will awaken most.

911 was false flag and it helped me get out of my brainwashing. im sure it helped more. If stef is reading, i saw you mention that you dont focus on a single crime of the state, but you should because it helps awake people

i think bitcoin is even worse than fiat currency. again its based on nothing of value its not trust worthy from a security stand point. its value is not reliable and you ever wondered where all this processing is going? could it be used for something bad? and i dont think people from liberty movement want to have a digital currency where everything you do is 100% tracked. competition of anything including currency is good, but i wouldn't participate in this game pardon me if this is the wrong thread to post my opinion