powder
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Posts
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Joined
Everything posted by powder
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Yes, this, I agree with most everything Stef says except his 'endorsement' of Trump. I would prefer to be able to share his videos and messages on other topics but I can't argue the case for voting and Trumpism for the reasons put forward in this thread by unmarried people like dsayers.
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I have been an anarchist since before I was old enough to vote. So I have only ever voted once in my life. The smallish city that I live in now had a referendum to give the city permission to build a 36 million dollar sports facility. It would increase property taxes by about $20 yr. they claimed. I was also working in a private sports facility that would likely go out of business if it had to compete with this new complex, I voted 'no'. The 'yes' vote won. The facility ended up costing over 60 million, has been a $ pit ever since, and the private club where I went, and others went out of business. Last year, the city had another referendum, an arts facility that would supposedly cost about 90million, and increase property taxes for home owners by about $40 yr. I did not vote, on principle. I got a bit of attention for my philosophical stance on the issue. I am well known here as a musician and esp as an artist (painter) so it was assumed I would be in favor of the project and I was actively being recruited for the 'yes' campaign. I was interviewed by the newspaper because there was a heated local debate between left and right, liberals and conservatives, and I was bringing in a completely different perspective. I think it made some people think, and consider property rights and freedom in a way that had not occurred to them before. It made a difference for the future because I know a number of people took what I said seriously and decided to look into it further.
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you don't understand, Stef says he has changed his position based on new information, but he also does say he stands by the position in the video you link,... wait,... hmmm,... I think that is what we are trying to sort out.
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Is voting not the act of delegating a right for someone to rule, or giving consent to be ruled, a right which no one has? If so, it is immoral.
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If your vote makes no difference then why vote? Esp. if it is an unprincipled act. BTW, I do think I and many others have learned a lot about freedom and philosophy on this forum and from FDR over the years. Your contributions have been impactful for me shirgall, though maybe not the last couple of posts,...
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Those are just assertions. No one knows the future nor can they predict it with any accuracy and history is full of examples of the people looking to saviors, like Hitler, coming in to rescue the nation only see things turn out, well, not so good. Because we cannot possibly know what will happen we cannot make choices based on potential consequences, only principles.
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Tyler has pointed to a couple already in this thread.
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really?
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I edited that so that you can better understand what it sounds like to me. They will never run out of boogie men to spook the herd back into the pen, every generation gets its own version. I just hope I am around long enough to witness the 'alien invasion' gig.
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Stef may indeed hurt his reputation as a voice for anarchy and freedom by endorsing the idea of putting Trump on the throne - however, FDR popularity and support have no doubt increased because of it.
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You get that immigration is a government program right? When the governments run out of money the welfare state will end, and so will mass immigration because these people cannot prosper in a higher IQ culture without welfare. When that happens, and the odds of that are better than a single politician being able to fix things, there needs to be a strong voice for freedom, those that have been right all along, to remind the people of why and how it continues to happen.
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It is also equally plausible, more so I would argue, that the destruction and decay of the statist system is reaching a point nearing unsustainable collapse, which is why so many are turning to the likes of Trump and Sanders because they are fed up with the statis quo that has brought us to the brink. Can Trump fix this mess? Will he keep his promises, or even have the ability to follow thru if he intends to? It is just as likely that the countries will run out of $ to support their entitlement programs and the immigration threat will be dealt with in that way. The rulers will turn on the ones they paid off for votes and blame them and the system will reboot. When the system fails them, they will look to those that have spoken for truth and freedom all along. The difference is, when the system goes sideways, people will look to those that have pointed to its falsehood all along and turn away from those that endorsed it. That is why we need to stick to principles and resist the temptation to look to effects and 'practical' solutions.
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Nope, not really the same. The ruling class are happy to go left/right, prosperous/poor, more/less freedom,... they are patient and are not worried about the short term stuff as long as the right to rule is never challenged. They don't care who gets on the throne, as long as you agree to have a throne by legitimizing the system in whatever way suits you. If they can find a way to scare people enough most will eventually run to their masters to save them, even if its 'just a chance to buy more time', that will do. By the time that crisis has passed the next generation will be uploaded with an updated version of the same threat and they will have had another chance to silence the voice of freedom. They are also happy to sacrifice any element of the perceived leaders of society, and its structures, to reboot the system even, to let the slaves blow off steam if that is what is required. It has happened many times throughout history. They also like you to believe that the kings, priests and politicians that are put in front of us to sell the agendas are in fact our rulers. I think there is a solid case to be made that that is not how the system works, but that is for another time.
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dsayers, are you interesting in calling in to the show to have the debate with Stef?
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I think there is a good reason to not vote and advocate or endorse Trump in any way, besides the moral argument presented by Tyler and Dsayers. The ruling class is very good at creating and promoting dire end of the world scenarios to get people to reach out to the state to save us all. They have been doing it for thousands of years. Every generation is given its apocalyptic scare situation that has to be addressed or else nothing else matters,... the Nazi's, Communism, Nuclear weapons, Terrorism, Climate Change, Immigration. I know that Stef argues that the Trump phenom is unique and that he has to change is position based on new evidence but I see the same pattern repeating throughout history - bring in the K to save the day: Flavian Caesars, Napolean, Hitler,... The down side is that like with Hitler anyone associated with him is demonized and dismissed after it gets ugly, the system gets a reboot, and the voice of freedom is lost until the oligarchs feel the pressure and have to do another purge.
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Donald Trump's Economic Policy
powder replied to PaxRyana's topic in Libertarianism, Anarchism and Economics
every generation is given its civilization ending crisis to make sure they run to the state to fix it, to safeguard the future, to buy time,... Nazi's, Commies, Immigrants, global warming,... the oligarchs are very good at this game and have been playing it for centuries. They know they only need to wait another generation for everyone to forget how the game is played. It is a very effective way to silence the voices of freedom who get suckered into it and reach for the ring. -
American politicians want to gain access to middle east resources and they do that by convincing Christians that it is a moral ('axis of evil') crusade that is consistent with biblical prophesy. I am glad to know that you are not one of those Christians, but have you never heard of 'dispensationalism'? Jerry Falwell, Billy Graham, millions of followers here. Google "Christians, Isreal, second coming" or just have a some conversations with Christians about the topic and let me know what they have to say. http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2012/02/evangelical-christians-want-to-start-wwiii-to-speed-the-second-coming-and-atheist-neocons-are-using-religion-to-rile-them-up-to-justify-war-against-iran.html
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I understand your point. It is not the same for Christians as it is for Muslims. Still, most fundamentalist Christians believe in the end times story involving the second coming in the Middle East and so do not actively oppose the interventions there as they think it is the fulfilling of biblical prophecy.
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How would you guys respond to this? http://usuncut.com/world/here-are-9-reasons-denmarks-socialist-economy-leaves-the-us-in-the-dust/ Comments -Keep in mind that nothing is free. It doesn't matter where you live. The taxes in Denmark are very high. And yet they are the happiest people in the world. -Yes they are. That's where most of my relatives live. -Absolutely agree but when society pools resources great things happen {as demonstrated by the Danes!
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can't disagree with that
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This is interesting to me. I joined FB a few months ago after years of colleagues telling me it was a good thing. I found out of course that many of them are lefty and quite political in their posts (artists and musicians mostly). I started to post the occasional argument and push back on some of the propaganda that was flying around. I don't post or link political or philosophical stuff on my personal and business pages but like regevdl, I recently learned that all my friends and followers can see the comments I post on other people's timelines. I am rethinking this idea now. I have had some good debates with a couple of people and had some positive feedback about my arguments, which of course are quite foreign to most.
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I listened to the FDR videos entitled 'wrong about atheism'. I don't want to discuss the atheist issue which has been covered in another thread. While I agree that the values Christians hold are more in line with mine than leftist ones, it is true that the problem of Muslim migration, which is why Stef claims he is changing his position on things because of a time crunch thing, is primarily a problem of Middle East military interventionism which is supported by a significant percentage of Christians. Some 70% of people in the US military are Christian. For many Christians, it is biblical, and they mostly cheer it on because the mayhem and devastation there is the harbinger of the second coming. I know, not all Christians are like that. What I don't see is Christians pushing back against those that are supporting the programs that are at the root of the problem. I did not hear Stef mention that this is what 'good' Christians should be doing in the same way that the 'good' Muslims should speak out and stand up to the dangerous policies promoted by their less than virtuous brothers and sisters in the faith.
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I must have missed this, can someone point to me where the explanation of the meaning of 'support' has been addressed directly?
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Those are good points. I appreciate the feedback. I am not sure I understand how it fits. As a political candidate for president, Donald Trump has the best possible chance of pushing back against the mainstream media and the influx of an incompatible culture. Have I got that right? If he can do that kind of good you would like to see and you will not help to get him in a position to do that good, then I don't understand. I get the whole, push back against the lies thing, but like you say, there are other places that can be done as well. To be clear, they are Facebook 'friends', not personal friends. Facebook is a business networking tool for me. I am having trouble with the situation of advocating anarchy and the NAP while defending material that points in the direction of supporting a political candidate. Stef says he has more in common with the conservative 'right' in politics and the modern christian religion. I agree, so do I. That said, I do speak out against the moral hypocrisy of religion for the same reason, and to the christian people I am close to. I don't like politics and religion for the same reason - they advocate the use of violence to solve problems. As to your last question, I would like to know why you think that is, though I am not entirely clear what you are referring to.
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Why would you not vote, and encourage anyone else to do so, and support his campaign, if you think it would be beneficial for Trump to gain the presidency? I understand the reasons mentioned for supporting Trump and in the video Mike posted above Stef says he would like to see Trump as president and would put him there if he could snap his fingers and do so. I don't see it as a positive thing for the reasons I stated in this thread: https://board.freedomainradio.com/topic/46844-am-i-out-in-left-field-here/ I am struggling with this because I have a lot of friends, esp on Facebook, and they are ALL, with one or 2 exceptions, lefty, socialist, collectivists (almost all artists and musicians like myself, so little surprise there). The jargon about the election and the amount of trashing of Trump is quite astounding, and I am in Canada. I see the interest and concern around this election as an opportunity to champion the voice of anarchy and the NAP. I would love to steer people to FDR's stuff but I don't know how I could navigate the blow back that it would create.
