MysterionMuffles

Lol I think the common misconception that journalling requires it to be a diary plastered with plastic pink gem stones where you just write about the boys you like.

I always felt iffy at school, but what pushed my experience further as nearly horrid was the teacher I had in grade 4. Let's call him Mr. RedGreen because he looked like that Canadian lumberjack character [link=http://txtriffidranch.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/rgreen.jpg]Red Green[/link] from the parody handyman show. Before I slander this teacher, to his credit he is the only reason why I highly value the use of the red pen when writing. It's a good colour to underline and box things in, also because when he taught us gymnastics in gym class, I got to learn how to flip and tumble which was nice. Especially since I got to be top of the pyramid in a school performance, so that's also cool. Oh oh and how could I forget the crafty wood work we got to do when making our own Rosaries?! He really WAS Red Green! Yep in the company of young children, he trusted us to use sanders to brush off the rough edges of our Rosaries fancied out of colourful beads and popsicle sticks for the Crucifix, to which he just engraved with an INRI in blue pen. [:O] Now onto the corrupted nature of this guy. He had a pretty good sense of humour considering that everyone in my class laughed at what he did to some students. There was this one kid in my class who he constantly made an example out of. This kid used to wear his pants down low like a gangsta, and simply from passing by this teacher, Mr. RedGreen gave him a nice boot to the ass and told him that having your pants on low is just an invitation to get your ass kicked...literally. We all thought it was funny, and so did I because it always eluded me why people would wear their pants in such a way. This same kid also had this habit of shrugging his shoulders when he didn't know the answer to, so Mr. Red Green also forced him to wear a meter stick around his shoulders in a oddly symbolic kind of crucifix and asked him all the questions we had to answer from our textbooks. The kid would try to shrug and of course he couldn't, again, what a riot huh? LASTLY...same kid, and I guess this isn't too bad, had a habit of losing his red pen. Mr. Red Green made a point for us to always write in specifically blue and red pen. Blue for everything, and red for underlining the titles and dates of our work. And to show that he was damn serious, he had this GIANT pencil, possibly the size of let's say...three guitar necks in circumfrence? And at the point of it was where you could put a writing utensil in, so Mr. Red Green forced this kid to keep that giant pencil/red pen, and hey what's the problem? How often did he really have to pull the giant thing out to underline stuff right? Right right, you can see that this man IS a bully, but he is clever and pretty witty in his approach. I would even forgive him a little for the fact that one time we had a lesson on reactivity for whatever subject I can't remember right now. Basically he acted like he was going to throw a ball at me and since I was a scared little kid (due to home shit I won't even have to mention in detail), I held my hands up over my head in defense. Then Mr. Red Green decided to try again at someone else who was just simply ready to catch it. He said something like "yes that is the correct way to react to a ball being thrown your way, not that...chicken stuff he did," in reference me. Something along those lines. Yeah I can forgive him for that because there wasn't really anything to be scared of. Here's where I feel a little off about this guy completely though, all hilarity aside. In the boys change room there was this scrawny kid, one much scrawnier than I was, which was surprising, who always liked to strip all the way down to just his briefs when he changed his clothes. Some other kids were telling him to get some damn clothes on or go into the washroom because no one wants to see his puny ass. How did I intervene? I didn't. I joined in like an asshole and said "yeah!" and proceeded to kick him square in the ass. He told Mr. Red Green on me and I was sent to the office. The discomfort in me rose so much more when Mr. Red Green asked me why I kicked that other kid in the ass, and I can specifically remember that moment thinking "well you kicked so and so in the ass before, and did all this other nasty stuff to him, so why am I all of a sudden in trouble for doing the same thing you did?" But...I couldn't muster the courage to say it out loud and I just don't know why. Anyways, that's my story. I would love to know what your opinion is on this teacher I had because I have a huge amount of ambivelance towards the whole thing.

welcome to the boards, Matt. lol a lot of that resonated with me. The whole part about getting suspended from school a lot, as well as disdain for authority. Reminds me of all the fights I picked with bully teachers just so I can earn a few days or even two weeks of a suspension just to play the newest video game I got. And of course my guitar to learn a whole System of a Down album (Steal This Album). I am sorry that your earliest memories have to be something traumatizing, and I'll take your word for it if you feel it was the best thing that your parents did split up. I suppose that dysfunction would have only been double of what you already had to experience with your mother alone, so you're pretty brave to laugh in her face for threatening you with a giant spoon. Lol I think I would too because it would seem almost too comical to take seriously. Especially if you're a kid who enjoys cartoons. You seem to have a great deal of self awareness when it comes to knowing your possible pathways and a sense of the world around you, so I think your initial intelligence will only increase from this point on. Glad to have you on board with the boards!

A nice and cute girl from Chapters recommended the book 1984 by George Orwell to me for an insight on society. It takes place where Thought Police exist and the government pretty much watches peoples every move. The movie's boring, stick with the book, it could open up your mind. I'm sure it will for me if I could find it and read further, but from the opening chapters I remember, I do remember seeing where this kind of setting would go.

I can understand your confusion. It is tough to criticize the Canadian government because it doesn't seem all that corrupted. They are kind of subtle about it I guess. To many people, our government seems like a joke in which our army consists of one mounty with a slingshot and an old beaten horse. I would say that we are pretty lucky that our system isn't too blatantly corrupt. But the fact that drugs are still too criminalized. Not a single province I know of has yet to legalize marijuana. A good argument in this case WOULD be the war on drugs. The fact that people go to jail for non-violent crimes is appalling. OH and there's this thing with cops here in Canada where they are so bored, they patrol areas just to catch people committing the smallest of crimes so they can get charged up the ass for it. For instance, I once got taking a left turn during the "wrong hours" which is usually designated so that rush hour doesn't clog up. BUT when I took that left turn, there were no cars coming from the end, and although I could have easily used another street before or after it, and of course I should have read the sign--I still got a ticket for it only because a cop was parked nearby to catch drunken St. Patty's drivers. It took months before I could even appeal the case and they disillusioned me with weird choices. Either I pay in full and get 2 demerit points on my license, or I get a reduced fine with no demerit points. The third choice I can't even remember, but who the hell would actively choose the first choice anyway?! Obviously I chose the reduced fine, but it was utter bullshit. I had to leave work at the middle of the day to sit around the court house in line with other minor crime committers, not get paid for those hours and continue to lose money to pay for something I did MONTHS prior to that day. What my point of this little story is this: when you argue about the Canadian government still being evil, despite being a "neccessary one" if that even makes sense, you mention how mental it is to get charged for menial things. I don't know what the fair reprecussion is for the "crime" I committed, but I sure as hell don't think taking money out of my pocket as well as pulling me out of work to pay it isn't fair. Not to mention that paycheck got TAXED anyway so I lost out on more income because of something so stupid. Well those are my two cents anyway.

Nope I don't and I'm glad that you have the resources to get therapy yourself. If anything, if my parents are too stuck up to really talk to me, I would tell them to pay for all my therapy now that I'm ready for it. When I was a troubled teen I went to a few therapists and disliked them all. There was one who seemed alright, but one day I was beyond saving for a while so I kinda brushed him off. I was thinking why are my parents wasting money on something they should be doing for me in the first place? Now I realize it's probably for the best to unload my traumas to someone who won't interrupt me or dismiss my experiences. BUT it's all good man ya know? As I always say, a $20 journal could save you thousands on therapy and I'm doing alright with just a pen, paper and my thoughts.

that is such a good metaphor about the islands and morse code

Oh I see...that's the fundamental flaw with some parents. They can't even muster the courage or common decency to listen to reason and honesty. I just had a discussion with my parents today and I told them about present day things they do that piss me off and WHY these things piss me off. Without getting too detailed about the content of it, basically my mom at first dismissed my personal experienced as probably my imagination, but as I continued to run my mouth (as I tend to do in heated family arguments), she came to acknowledge what childhood wounds I had. But the way she avoided eye contact and the dismissive "yeah yeah yeah" I got it is just fucking frustrating. My mind is so warped right now from the continuing lack of empathy it's not only mind boggling, but heartbreaking too. And when I had this discussion with them, I made sure to take in consideration how they would feel and how they initially feel, and never once tried to play the blame game. I said you did this when I was a kid, I internalized it and thus I held resentment. That's my fault to take it personally. At least my mom felt guilty enough to say "no it's mine"...probably for the sake of shutting me up. She would have had more credibility in my eyes if she would go on to explain herself, but nope, just the dismissive saying what I want to hear kind of thing. It's too bad that's not what I want to hear. In fact what I want to hear is genuine acknowledgement of what I was saying and what I was feeling, but never once did I feel that. MAYBE from my dad which is surprising, since it's my mom who I usually get to talk about personal stuff with, but even he got irritated enough to just say "eat your food it's getting cold." Maybe I am being a pessimist, but I really can't shake the feeling that they just don't care and would much rather avoid it all together. I can't think straight right now, I just can't. And I want to refrain from revealing all the intricate details and triggers. All I want to say is, I gave it a shot and even told them I bring this shit up because I care about the family. I want us to have real conversations and be honest about our feelings. BUT NOPE, even then I gotta get ignored. If it isn't in the realm of day to day hogwash, and it is too important of a topic, then I gotta get ignored and dismissed. Let's stick to criticizing the rest of our family or talking about mundane things like the weather. I have no love left for my parents if they can't even acknowledge that I want to have open discussions so that we know how the other feels. If they can honestly say they spanked out of love, then do I not have the right to say I bring up the past out of love so that they know what affect they had on me? NOTE that I didn't say what they DID to me as some kind of victim, just talking about it objectively, this is the effect it had on me. Ughhh...I'm gonna appreciate all the financial support I'm getting and the home I get to stay in, but once I'm financially independant, I can't wait to defoo. Until then I'll keep treading the waters of honesty with them to see if they could ever open up.

These are the things I had to learn for my self after graduation. *sigh* not even in religion class did we learn how to empathize with people. It was just cryptic dissections of Bible passages and weird band-aid solutions to personal conflicts.

hey welcome to the boards! I, like you, had grown up thinking about equality for children. Glad to hear that despite your parents being Catholic, they were still peaceful people. That is a lucky straw pulled in your favour, sir! As a kid, I always knew it was wrong to be so small and treated so poorly, because every time something happened that made me think that, I always dreamed of having revenge when I got older. Never getting revenge on kids when I'd become an adult, just the aggressors. Isn't it enlightening to find Stef's content to resonate with you on every possible way? All the aspects of philosiphy are things we question throughout our lives from one time or another, but then when we discover FDR, all of it rings true and comes full circle! And hey don't worry about long posts, I think we're all infamous for that, so no need to be too self conscious about it.

what was it about the content of your letter that made her break down?

Part of the reason why I'm on the path of self knowledge now is because I've wronged people a many back in my unconscious days. Days where all I could care about was my own selfish gains and so acted out in counterproductive and highly negative interactions. I'm only caring, compassionate, and empathetic NOW because there was a giant lack of those virtues in my past. I still feel guilt to this day for the way I've wronged a few people, and I feel like there's some amount of evil in my being. Am I redeemed through the repetition of positive actions now, or is that a subjective thing within my self? Like an either I forgive my self or I don't?

I find it fortunate that I am financially supported. I get some home cooked meals, some of which I'm learning to make my self, access to a free car to go about as I like. What I find unfortunate is the lack of genuine connectivity from my parents with me and my siblings. To be fair they have their moments, but it's usually in casual stuff. Kind of wish we could run deeper and talk about more important stuff.

Interesting story, welcome to the boards. MGS games always had the effect on me, especially with their endings that make me feel like Snake's missions were all for naught due to even bigger conspiracies. They do do a good job at tackling some censhorship and control issues. As for the thing with your mum's everchanging beliefs, you are now proof that kids are BORN rational. If you witnessed that kind of inconsitency it was only a matter of time. BTW are you actually listening from Podcast 1 after the other, or do you just get the ones you're interested in? I have a lot of free time on my hands, and I'm sure others have somewhat busier lives, I just wonder how they would find the time to consume every last podcast without skipping to what is more relevant to your own personal interests.

Sounds about right. I feel like I would develop new fears out of success and because I've been at this "level" for so long, a part of me doubts I can take on bigger things. For instance, I JUST finished writing a novel recently that I've been working on for two years. Along the way, I kept fearing how shameful it would feel if once I completed it, I would never get it published. I rationalized it as, if I never did get it published, at least I stuck it out and did something I was dedicated to. That freed up my mind to get a bit more optimistic, but then I thought, if I DID get it published, what if doesn't sell? Then if it did sell well, what if it got hated like the Twilight franchise? All these inherent fears held me back from continuing and forgetting how much absolute joy I truly get when I finally decide to sit down and write. All those nights that came from days or weeks of stagnancy, I had to always re-remember constantly how much joy I'm putting off. Another thing about procrastination is the perceived negativity of something that is meant to be a joyful process. We put things off not only because the fear of shame, but also resistance to what's important. I can totally connect with Stef's video about procrastination where when we were children, we were hassled to do chores and thus grew a distaste for things that need to be done around the house because they weren't presented as pleasurable to us. They were always in conflict with what I wanted to do in the moment like play video games. So this book to me is really important and that inner child of mine feels berated by the adult--one with possibly illusional obligations to make something out of my self--who says enough play time, come on and write. That is led by resistance because at the moment, I don't feel like confronting my own emotional demons in the form of fiction, but once I can get over it and finally sit down, then it becomes easy peasy. Same thing with house chores. They feel like bores, but recently I've resisted putting them off and I am now getting quicker to responding to the environment so that I don't feel bogged down by them. At first it used to be "I gotta get this out of the way," but now I can see the joy in doing house chores. Like matching fresh socks that just came from the washer and dryer. It turns into a game of mixing and matching. Folding clothes becomes a game of how well I can fold them. Sometimes it turns out retarded looking (I use the word retard looslely) and sometimes it's eloquent. Anything can turn into a game if you just devote yourself to being attuned to the moment in which you're confronted with it.

LOL sounds about right

I was talking to somebody else, and no, it is a serious question. Tribes and cultures have different ways of raising members and a lot of times there are initiations, and rites of passage, and spiritual beliefs that they value. Maybe in some tribe it is considered absolutely normal to discipline kids with rods until they show blood. Maybe the bleeding has a different meaning spiritually and the children grow up feeling different about it than you might think. They may associate it NOT with fear or abuse but with spiritual healing. Who are you to say? Who am I to say? Well I am [8]the Magical Man from Candy Land, who lives in a gumdrop house at Lollipop Lane[8]

^^Passive aggressive posts^^

yeah Moncaloono, I don't know what your problem is. I've shown nothing but consideration for your arguments but you just keep disregarding everything I say and reinstating what you already firmly believe. At least I'm taking in new information and disputing that in particular instead of making the same argument over and over again. We can say we're done with each other til our keyboards break, but the fact remains; you're the only one still trying to engage in this after you explicitly THREATENED me a few posts back. I think you're well deserving of the title of a troll if you're gonna act plenty aggressive towards me and then act like it didn't happen without any mention of it or even an apology. You're not even taking responsibility for how you rub me the wrong way. At least I've shown you SOME compassion in that I accept your arguments as yours and have yet to brush any of it off as baseless. CLEARLY reason doesn't work with you because you've grown addicted to the "not" abuse your parents treated you with. Your justifications for the way you were treated by them is already enough evidence for me to know that you're just acting out. You want to test boundaries, and you did that with your parents on purpose, and you got the slaps. Enough of them to TEACH you a "good" lesson. But now that you're an adult with a heavy burden on your shoulders, you're starting to realize just how shitty you lost as a kid despite of how hard you try to defend your parents. I don't care by this point to even consider if they provided you the essentials. The main fact is that they treated your poorly enough, and you haven't done the right self work recognize when you're wrong and admit it. So you feel the need to take it out on us anonymous online folk because here you can test our boundaries all day long with your senseless banter and NOT get those slaps you so definitely crave. You kind of get them in the form of everyone else railing against you and rightfully so, but I know even that inner sadist within you likes the fact that you're taking on simutaneous amounts of people. Ah I can't believe I wasted another 5 minutes typing up two paragraphs you will obviously not read anyway. For you to tell me that you're not gonna read my comments anymore is laughable seeing as you never really read what I said up to this point anyway. WHATEVER GO AHEAD, accuse this post of being passive aggressive. To me it's like a game now: how irrelevant will Moncaloono's next post be? I WONDER!!!

I am sorry to put it this bluntly, but I think I have made my case sufficiently and this is very good evidence you provide: - Stop thinking that discussing the effects of spanking will change anything. Abuse will get done anyway - as you can see - and not necessarily in the form of spanking. This is not just unique to your situation, and FDR does not do follow up studies on any of these cases - that I know of - buy merely publishes people's words about how good they are to their children. - Start thinking from first principles about this - not just about god and the state - and having logical conversations with the people around you about the ways in which they justify their behaviour towards yourself and the children. - Stop debating trolls. I am available and willing to chat privately if you would like to. Good luck. Actually that does suffice. I am tending to over think it. Ultimately she's not my kid and I can do the best I can when she's with me, but whatever they do at their home is their own business. Any reprecussions they will have to face will be of their own folly and only then I must tell them...well "I told you so" is kind of arrogant and overplayed. I'd tell them "I informed you thusly!" And yeah...I don't know why I continue the troll battle. I came here after a string of video game forums in my life and I've obviously developed a keen sense of sniffing out the trolls. Moncaloono? Whether he means what he says or not, he is undeniably trolling us all and I guess my anger stems from the fact that I have a specific and personal topic I lay on the table, but it is being shoved off that table and replaced with another argument altogether. It's like shoving a Thanksgiving turkey off the table and replacing it with a sack of shit. The troll battle and the shit with my family...yeah I learned it's not my job to change anyone. All I can do is lend empathy to those who seem to be losing it before they ever reach the point of no return. It seems highly unlikely because on the flipside my cousin and her husband have the capacity to be loving and caring to my neice regardless, but it's just corrupted in a strange 180 turn of values from time to time. I'll just wait until I have my own children to fully implement my parenting technique without interruptions of its progress I guess... I realize I am trying to hard to replace her parents and even that feels wrong on a different level, just obviously not as worse as how their behaviour is that DRIVES me to act otherwise. Thanks everyone for your input, even Moncaloono who's boundary challenging ways have at least helped me reaffirm what I know is correct in my heart. I think I will leave this topic alone unless there is some more sound advice amongst the flooding troll battle.

My line is my line. I mean, this is a philosophically personal question. That's the whole point. And it's a good point. See, the parent has a real duty to be the best they can be, and just saying spankings is abuse is fraudulent. You cannot blindly call spankings abuse, and not know what a spanking really is. The question you asked illustrates the dillemna. If a parent hits a child and it leaves black and blue marks, draws blood, breaks bones, leaves a child in pain for more than a minute, and things like that there are probably some major health concerns to the child, but if the spanking is slight but strong enough to prevent the child from performing a dangerous act the next time, then it is a good spanking technique. Of course this is not all that hard to figure out for the parent if they love their child. And spanking really doesn't do anything healthy for a child after they are old enough to rationalize danger. At that point the technique is probably no use anymore. Also if your child doesn't respond to spankings at a safe level, it's a good idea to stop spanking because you could end up pushing the spanking too rough to try and get a response and it could hurt the child. Not all children respond to spankings, but a lot do respond to a well used spank. They shouldn't cause real pain, for more than a minute tops before the sensation is gone and no marks are left. Before a certain age, and while children are too young to process danger, yet are walking around and touching everything they can REALLY put themselves in danger and lectures don't help. A quick and non angry spanking can save a childs life, or prevent scarring physical harm that far far far excedes the short lived shock of a little spanking that a lot of times keeps the child from doing that dangerous thing the next time. To Moncaloono: This is actually the most sense you made so far. Thank you for your input and for not resorting to any dismissive insults while you made your claim. It was well thought out, I must admit. You almost had me convinced that you can kind of blur the line between spanking and all out abuse, until of course you coined the term "non angry spank."Is it really possible to spank with a smile? Even with a cold neutral face, the slap is still agressive, just passive. It's hard to tell what will hurt or not to the degree if it leaves a mark, and even if it doesn't leave a mark, the internal pain is not up to you to determine based on the severity you choose to strike with. Both physical and emotional. And of course something I did not consider is the child's ability or inability to rationalize what just happened. Some children are born more sensitive than others and would internalize that spank and develop the habit of haboring internal resentment. And since they're confused about why someone who loves them is also hurting them, they get confused and may end up turning the hatred inward without any rational realization that that anger is meant to be towards their agressive parent. Whether the agression is passive or direct. Then of course some other children can be born more thick skinned and can forgive and forget, so to speak, about the spanking. They will learn to think "oh I did this again, and it got me a slap in return AGAIN. I hate getting slapped, so maybe I shouldn't try to do that anymore." With this kind of child in question though, I still don't see how often a spanking would have to occur for this kind of child to eventually become a beckoning sadist to the point that they want to test not only their own boundaries, but the boundaries of their own parents acceptance and anger, so they could make a game out of what will warrant them a slap on the hand, wrist, or behind. FACE if you're willing to go that far. That may be me speaking biasly about the thick skinned child, but it is the only rational way I can look at it. Even a kid who is more forgiving despite of slaps, perhaps, will learn to rationalize hypothetical situations and understand their parents enough to the point where they truly CAN think of many different boundaries they will innately know not to cross, due to the FEAR of possibly getting slapped. But that's the underlying and core basis of why most of us here are disputing the idea that a slap in any case is fundamentally wrong. The fact that obedience through spanking is driven by FEAR. I can agree that fear is a healthy feeling when it comes to knowing not to walk into traffic or jumping off a bridge. But fear in this case is pretty faulty and doesn't really garner true respect towards the parent. They just end up being seen as these bigger and almighty, infallible GODS who the children must bow dow to, lest they get the cold sting of their palm. I digress though...I know we can go back and forth with this argument, but I would very much like to get back to the topic at hand here. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- To Everyone Else: I made the claim that my cousin and her husband had stopped spanking my neice. I regret to report that I was dead wrong. I'm not sure about the husband, he hasn't told me anything about what he's done and I haven't seen him treat her poorly since that night I made my idle threat over his daughter's future. Every time I've seen him with her, he has been playful and loving. But I am absolutely certain my cousin is the one now inflicting the spankings. When she comes to visit us on days where I don't specifically have to babysit and she's just here to hang out, she makes a few unwarranted mentions of how things are at home. She says that my neice sometimes pisses her off to the point that she threatens to spank her "but I don't actually do it," yet right before my very eyes, she's getting irritated with her all the time. Counting to three, only staying on one when my neice does something as inconsequential as spitting out food on the floor. As a side note, it's too fucking bad that that's how my neice is around her mother. Meanwhile when it comes to me in her care, she lets food dangle off the edge of her mouth until I can get to her and let her spit it out into my hand. Back to my cousin...within the same 10 minutes I've seen her slap my neice's hand and as well her butt upon picking her up, which interrupted her innocent play where nothing of value was breaking or anything like that. My neice will always do something minor in annoyance, but nothing to really fuss about, and my cousin will always say to me, "and you tell me not to hit her when she makes me so angry." I don't know how to explain to her that anger is never due to the cause of any external factor, it's just you failing to deal with your own emotional management. I don't know how to explain it to her because either a) her English sucks ass, so maybe her capacity to understand such a concept might be difficult or b) she will dismiss it with a passive "mmhmm yeah exactly" that speaks of a tone that she really didn't listen to what I had just said. A few times this has happened and I'm pretty sure I didn't give her any parenting tips in a condascending way or when anything wrong was happening. Just examples out of my own experience with her very same daughter in which behaviours and tantrums were evened out peacefully. I dunno, maybe my cousin is that stubborn in being stuck in her ways. ANYWAYS THIS POST IS LONG AS HELL, so I will finish off with this: My sister is now starting to take a stand, where during a family party, everyone was asking why my neice was crying. My sister just said really out loud, "because her mom slapped her!" Which was true because they were all there to witness it while I was off somewhere else. It's just disheartening that everyone ignored her and tried to get back to their iPhones or idle conversation... So thankfully I have an ally on this stand and my question is now this: Do I deal with my cousin directly and approach her the way I intended her husband; with a bit of empathy as well as genuine curiousity as to why she spanks her daughter or do I start educating the younger generation of my family that are close to my age and my sister's so that my cousin and her cousin begin to feel outnumbered when it comes to the twisted morality they use to justify treating their daughter in such a way?

http://www.violence.de/prescott/bulletin/article.html ??????? You asked for links with evidence and footnotes, and although I'm not the one you asked, I still provided. You wanted a link that was a non Stef video and there you have it. Proof that spanking is abuse with charts and figures to substantiate their effects.

http://www.violence.de/prescott/bulletin/article.html

Well it's really easy to react in the moment of frustration to react harshly towards the opposite party. It takes real courage and self control to quiet the mind and develop a better answer to conflict. Let's take a look at road rage for instance. Any time a guy cuts you off, whether intentionally or not, anybody who's anybody would have the natural reaction to chase after that car and run them into the highway railings. But of course you wouldn't actually do that, instead you probably flip them off or honk your horn to communicate that they rubbed you the wrong way. How about if you're walking down the street and your'e approaching a puddle. At the same time you try to walk around it, a jogger rushes past you and accidentally bumps into you. Not on purpose, but out of mere coincidence...do you chase after them and kick their ass? Even if they apologize? How about this Moncaloono, assuming you still have a relationship with your parents. Say that they get really old and senile, and they start to lose their normal congnitive functions. They are under YOUR care when they are dependant on you to take care of them now with the whole role reversal. Mother of father, take your pick. One of them can't stand on their own without assistance, can't wipe their own ass after going to the washroom, or can't even prepare their own meals anymore. Would you hit THEM if they just so happened to call for your help while you were busy doing something else that you would prefer not to be halted from? Let's get more specific, say this parent is dependant on using a walker to get around, but you see them letting it go, and risking a fall by barely supporting themselves by surrounding furniture to steady themselves as they walk over to something they dropped on the floor nearby. Would you hit them to teach them to keep from endangering themselves?

I think its a combination of laziness and being taught by their family that this sort of violence is the right way to do things. If somebody here introduced these ideas to a spanking parent they would get frustrated and lash out, because we'd be telling them they are not in the moral high ground that they were convinced they were in. When it comes to something this big in somebody's life, losing the moral high ground is not something most people can handle rationally. Especially people who have convinced themselves that hitting people is a very very bad way to solve problems except when they are still small, young, and defenseless. wow when you put it that way, it sounds depressing and really fucked up... VIOLENCE IS WRONG...unless you have a significant physical advantage