PatrickC

Virtue isn't an emotional reflex.. It's a positive response to those that are like minded and hold the same values as ourselves.

This is why you will never make any sense on this forum.. Caring about the consciousness of trees and then insulting the curiosity of those who attempt to help you seems to be standard for those that come here to troll.

DeepGreen, forget about animals fella.. From my personal xp this has everything to do with your childhood and barely nothing to do with cruelty to animals and in particularly, 'trees'. If you start thinking trees are conscious like humans, then you know there's a problem.

Yes, that's right Josh, you old bean! It seems I missed a conversation you all had yesterday.. If you give me some notice, I will try to join next time.

Mines on my profile page.. Feel free to hit me up when you chaps start a discussion.

Yes there is a balance of course.. I think the trick is understanding the difference between how 'deep' you enter that cave. If it's too avoid conflict rather than just some quiet personal moment of gathering strength, then it certainly can be a problem.. I'm just very conscious how the 'man cave' has been lauded as some kind of male dysfunction over the years, when often it's a way for a man to concentrate momentarily on those important aspects to his life, including the family and friends around him.I will say however, that this is a thought in progress for me. But anecdotally I have founnd the women in my life of recent years appreciate and accept my brief moments of 'aloneness'. We went way off topic hey?.. Sorry Ivan..

Yes, but that's under the current assumption that men do retreat entirely. I don't actually think they do. but I agree that if they do, then certainly they risk losing that relationship.That said I have found most women appreciate that moment of male clarity that occurred in their quieter (private) moments.

Just to be clear.. the 'man cave' is not a place women put men. Men certainly choose to go there. It just seems to be quite normal for men to decide at certain times (and rationally too and other times less so) to not engage. Other times it's a retreat from harm... It is ultimately a shared responsibility between both partners of course. It's not particularly reflective of either a male or female dysfunction.That said, I assume from the many male relationships I have had, that it can seem like their lady puts them there. But from a psychological perspective it really isn't. It's mostly their own history with 'not' having their own needs met. Juxtaposed by the responsibility for meeting the needs of others that makes some men retreat entirely. Yes I have known guys that retreat to their garden shed sadly.Given that situation, it could be that any partnership based on unprocessed history could decide their relationship was not the better one.. Not to say that relationship can never be improved, because I'm sure it can. Well I don't see the 'man cave' as being entirely negative.. It allows a man to gather his thoughts, restrain himself and improve his future.

I tend to think 'shallow' is the lack of intimacy. Moreover it can be a retreat into safety, at least in part I think.. This is the great draw for us men into our caves of course. Something I've started to negotiate with better recently. The 'man cave' doesn't always have to be about avoidance. It can also be a time for great reflection and resurgence I think.. It's just a question of understanding your reasons for retreating there.. I see the 'man cave' as a great opportunity to learn more about myself.

I just think the biological differences make men concentrate on creating resources by their own means much more than women. Men have a huge biological incentive to do so. Which is why many women pursue beauty too for exactly the same reasons. This may point to why Mishelle found some women to be dreadfully shallow when she was younger. Although I liked your catch when you considered your own interests as equally shallow, just absurdly different. I'm paraphrasing here of course :)The thing is, in reality you cannot avoid the monkey brain entirely. You just don't let it guide your every decision. It's analogous to saying, 'OK enough chocolate, thanks'.

No, given your definition Ivan. I would say both men and woman have the capacity for shallowness. If it's 'resources' for the ladies it can certainly be 'beauty' for many men. My take on all this frankly, is that there is nothing intrinsically wrong (immoral) with wanting resources or beauty. Just be conscious of it and make sure it doesn't dictate entirely the final decision about whom you have a relationship with (it's only a factor). However, I do understand the 'annoying' factor for men, insofar as they have to work towards building those resources. Whereas a beautiful women, well she's just beautiful because of unchosen and unworked for genes. However, be that as it may I still think conscious philosophical women can certainly rise above their natures, however beautiful they are.

I agree FP.. But how about you do one too fella.. Only if you want too of course. I'd like to hear your thoughts in more detail all the same, if you wanted to share them. In many ways Benn played from the sidelines politically, certainly in his later years. That said, my generation were in rapture with his tomfoolery. So I think he bares some responsibility for encouraging the leftist mindset in our current culture. This despite his more recent anti war protestations. He is however, infinitely more likable than Claire Short or God forbid that harridan Harriet Harman..

The 'Left' dominates contemporary politics.. The 'Right' are mostly stooges to prop up the fallacy that the 'Left' have no power.. It's quite brilliant how the 'Left' have twisted the propaganda.

I'm feeling a very recent relief from the leftist perspective.. But after my guests have departed, I will certainly take a listen and give you my thoughts. Chomsky is about the only leftist I can respect intellectually (despite his many contradictions), so it's still probably worth a listen.

You know, I could be way off here. But from my own history with my concern or nerves about engaging with women for romance possibilities stemmed from my relationship with my mother. So my question would be, what was your experience of asking your mother to meet needs in the moment and how did she respond when she decided to not meet those those needs or desires?

This seems like a thoroughly responsible approach to raising children.

Interesting video Phee.. Sexual Market Value (SMV) is a long overlooked dynamic in relationships of course. However, I would say that the short supply in marriage is not just about the pill. It's also about welfare too. Both situations tend to reduce the necessity or desire for marriage, for both men and women. Not just men.

There is a contemporary 'class warfare' going on at the moment that is attempting to criminalize peoples thoughts in Europe (via political correctness), with the accusation of 'hate speech'.

Laws are always oppressive.. They are at best a reflection of most peoples opinion, but not always.

Good stuff Johnny.. Look forward to the update fella!

Ha, being accused of being 'unreasonable' sounds suspiciously like the argument from offense.. As Kevin eruditely responds in the manner of a wise sage, "compared to what?"

Thanks for the update Michael... The Grasshopper cafe .. j/k Considering the state visit by royalty, it might be better to avoid the centre of the city entirely. As Ruben Z has already mentioned Vondelpark is a nice location to meet up if the weather is fine. A nice quiet and peaceful little park to sit in as I recall, away from the hustle bustle of the city.

This lifeboat scenario is a 'false dichotomy'... I shan't repeat the otherwise good points dsayers has already mentioned.

This is a great idea Wesley.. I have been concentrating quite hard recently on developing my art again, after some hiatus. I'm on the verge of finishing a piece within the next month, which I hope to show on the boards first.

Yes, unless I'm mistaken I believe I've heard Stefan use the word at least twice.. But granted I don't have any direct evidence to fall on right now. So if I'm wrong, then help us out with a link fella. Like Lance, I find the word can induce a significant catharsis, when used in the right context.